Deliverance rant

[warren-ragnarok]

sounds like you had a bad tank lol, you have my sympathy, especially as a person that mains war currently, and been playing it for a long while. but in all truth as well, you can kind of blame SE for it, because the only true advantage now of using defiance is the health boost, enmity boost, and self heals boost (yes, thats right, heals from a healer dont get the 20% boost anymore) so in some cases, deliverance is better. but if the tank isnt bright enough to know that he needs defiance to hold hate, he shouldnt be a tank.

next time you come across a war like that, you should kick them for "different play styles"

[Ralvenom]

It's not really worth waiting 30s+ before you even pull trash.

I don't wait at all between pulls. I don't HAVE TO. I still make full use of 4 of my CDs every single pull.

[StouterTaru]

I don't wait at all between pulls. I don't HAVE TO. I still make full use of 4 of my CDs every single pull.

Unless you are doing big pulls, 2 minutes per trash pull is ugh. If you are doing those big trash pulls, then you'll get a whole lot more damage stacking unchained and berserk, and using overpower. Of course you don't get the big e-peen ST number in your chat log, but stuff dies faster.

[ArdorGrey]

If you are doing those big trash pulls, then you'll get a whole lot more damage stacking unchained and berserk, and using overpower.

deliverance is 5% more raw damage and 10% more crit, on top of one more decimate. How exactly is unchained defiance stronger than that? It's not like you suddenly cant use op in deliverance. And no I'm not endorsing the waiting game, but unchained should really only be used as an opener before you zerk at all or if for some reason a pull drags out and you burn through all your other defensive cd's and need to turtle up again.

If you use vengeance near the start of every pull it'll be back up by around the same in the next pull in my experience. With really good dps maybe not, but that's rare in df. And sorry about misunderstanding what you said before, running on not much sleep atm. XD

[StouterTaru]

deliverance is 5% more raw damage and 10% more crit, on top of one more decimate. How exactly is unchained defiance stronger than that? It's not like you suddenly cant use op in deliverance. And no I'm not endorsing the waiting game, but unchained should really only be used as an opener before you zerk at all or if for some reason a pull drags out and you burn through all your other defensive cd's and need to turtle up again.

If you use vengeance near the start of every pull it'll be back up by around the same in the next pull in my experience. With really good dps maybe not, but that's rare in df. And sorry about misunderstanding what you said before, running on not much sleep atm. XD

8 overpower and a steel cyclone will beat out 3 decimate and single target swings on a huge pull, and staying in defiance you don't have to worry about that bad healer in the DF. If you're doing huge pulls, you should have solid AoE dps in the party. If you're doing small pulls and taking two minutes per pull, then the dps is seriously lacking.

[Aurius]

I don't wait for infuriate to come back, or unchained. Just an opener that solidifies hate and makes deliverance pushes easier. Thrill in defiance gives more health for a heal, so use it and then switch to deliverance, you keep the 20% gain in deliverance and got 5% more health for pushing a button. Stances are ogcd so the switch is miniscule. If you have 20k in defiance thrill heals 4k, 800 more health than deliverance at 16k. It's just hit it, switch stances, that easy.OP spam may be a good means of DPS on trash, I've honestly never parsed it, my DPS in dungeons is always good in my opinion so maybe I'll check it out. As the waiting goes, we know the expert dungeons/Alex so well that you know where the next pull is. Time it, this is xenos aggro opener and its a huge DPS increase.

[ArdorGrey]

snip

Yeah I thought you meant use thrill when you were sitting in defiance, I can definitely get behind using it before deliverance in some situations.

Op spam is huge if you pull big on trash. I SHOULD clarify for any fresh wars out there reading this I'm not saying everyone should go ham on pulls, but once you're comfortable pulling big berserk>bloodlust>decimate>infuriate>op spam>decimate right before berserk drops is huge. pop RI + awareness, vengeance, or even just foresight, though if you pull big vengeance should be up for every pull by the time you've set up aggro and 4 stacks(try to get up 2 while pulling ;> ). This should also be handy in A2s.

1 decimate needs 5 stacks built to throw out. If you have a lot of tp issues with op spam it may seem preferable, but with enough practice you can throw a lot of OP without stopping to recover tp at all. Even with vengeance and raw intuition triple decimate requires you to burn almost all your zerk gcds single targeting. giving up one decimate in exchange for op spam the whole time would be a huge dps increase in comparison.

there are gray areas where there will be one problematic mob where getting up eye *might* be worth it. but that's what being a good warrior is about: being adaptable and flexible and never getting too rigidly stuck in a single rotation to use in all situations.

[Aurius]

I'm sorry, sholdve clarified, I try to run with healers I know. When unchained is falling off they let me drop to about 50% health. I pop equilibrium and thrill and I'm sitting at about 16k (enemies pummeling me while I hit buttons) I feel if I switch to deliverance from defiance, having an excess of deliverance hp is a waste as it is lost, so that's how I use it.

[dank1]

I dont even need read past the "drk wave" comment to know youre the issue here and not the wars/drks you need to chill out and improve your skills as a healer rather than giving up at the slightest thing that doesnt go your way

[RecklessLion]

Yeah sadly I know the pain. Ever since I switched to monk have a dps class for my FC I've been seeing a very bad line of warriors. And it's sad because Warrior is my main job. I take pride when I do it. Honestly I don't stance dance as much as I should I'll admit. I like being tanky. I though when I stance dance on mobs usually I pop Vengeance and berserk for the extra damage aggro. At the end of the day I'm still a tank and I still have a job to do. Plus I don't mind having my healer DPS. I get nothing but mad love from all my healer. But this new wave of warriors hurts I won't even lie. I'm not the best but no sense should 20-30 min dungeon runs double in time because WAR wants to hit stuff for fun....