Leve Balancing: Can I Have it?

[Deminia]

I actually don't mind having to travel around to deliver leves (although I do wish there was more fun to do than simply walk/ride here and turn in). I don't like having to zigzag back and forth for so many of them though. As a result, I have often not bothered to take leves that would drag me to a camp I had otherwise no other reason to visit (such as Camp Bluefog for example). I really don't want to head out in the middle of nowhere just to turn in 1 leve. If I also had battlecraft leves to do there, other quests, other interesting content to do as well - then yes, I would not mind the trip so much.

I am hoping that as they redesign things more, they will also add more to do at all those additional camps that currently have almost no reason to exist.

[Jinko]

I was so ecstatic about your last point that I skimmed over these before, and I wanted to address them.. because I don't understand them.



Not to be dramatic about this but.. GOOD GOD, WHY?!

On one hand, you seem to be about equal and reasonable distribution of leves, and then you want to restrict it by city. From a storyline mode, this makes no sense - why does no one have any goldsmithing needs in Limsa Lominsa or Gridania? Now, I wouldn't sacrifice gameplay for the sake of story.. but it has no gameplay benefit either. In fact, in the case of fieldcraft, it's worse, as you can only gather particular materials in certain regions.

I mean, do you think that Archers should only be able to do battlecraft leves in Gridania simply because the guild is there? I don't really see any jump in logic there. Sure, all of the DoW/DoM leves are grouped now, but using your ideal local leve system, it should use the guild instead, and therefore should only be available in that city.

Firstly you can only get guildmarks from the city that houses the guild, so why would you do leves anywhere else anyway ?

Granted you could argue that guildmarks are near useless now, but its down to SE to make them more interesting.

It's also not so much spreading people out as it is segregating them. Many people focus on one or two crafts, and if they can only get leves in one city, it doesn't do them much good to hang around the others. So you won't see many weavers in Gridania the same way you won't see many carpenters in Limsa Lominsa. Then you just end up with everyone in the same place, looking the same, doing the same thing. And I doubt that's what you had in mind when you wanted to spread out the population. There may be other, more subtle ways to accomplish that, but I don't think this is it.

Oh come on we have airships now its less than 2 mins to get from one city to the other there is no restriction other than people being lazy.

Just because the guild is in Gridania doesn't mean that other city states don't requests for items to be crafted. (if I wanted to buy a new TV I wouldn't request one from my local butcher)

So how about a weaver who is also a Con, he will be in Uldah doing his weaving leves and in Gridania doing his Conjurer leves.

Gladitor guild is in Ul'dah and BSM & ARM guild is in Limsa, It would even out perfectly.

SE could further ease this problem by making all marketwards linked across cities so that people didn't have to worry about not being able to find the items they are after.

Further more right now everyone (and i mean everyone) gathers in Ul'dah so we need some way of spreading out people into other cities and giving Limsa and Gridania a purpose.

This has gotten way off topic :S

[Arcell]

Yeah, way off topic lol. Basically all that needs to be done is that Disciples of Hand and Land need to have their leve availability bumped up to at least on par with Disciples of War and Magic.

For crafting I would even suggest further refining the system by having it only issue leves that are appropriate for the level of your craft. For example, if you're level 32 it should offer Level 30 and 35 leves but not 1-25. Once you hit 35 it should stop offering the 30 leves and offer 35 and 40 if you should be brave enough to try them. I can't think of a good reason for a crafter to do leves far under their level range.

[Sephrick]

Just a quick bump to say I fully support the notion that there needs to be a better selection of leves for at least DoH.

Nothing is worse than trying to level you class with a handful of rank 1 leves because of the absurd distribution.

[AamesxDavid]

Firstly you can only get guildmarks from the city that houses the guild, so why would you do leves anywhere else anyway ?

Translation: I only do leves that acquire guild marks, so other people shouldn't be allowed to do ones that don't. Nice.

Granted you could argue that guildmarks are near useless now, but its down to SE to make them more interesting.

I would, in fact, argue that. But that's a temporary problem, the bigger reason is that I care more about experience than I do the things you get with guild marks, even once they make them worth something again.

But you know what, all that aside, all I'm talking about is having more options. Maybe I want to do my goldsmithing and my armorcraft one day. It's convenient that I can get leves for those in the same city. And your argument for making that less convenient.. is that you think it's neat. Fine, you can go on about how it's not that big of a deal, but the point is that the restriction is completely unnecessary. I could petition for an extra NPC you have to talk to by the exit from the city before you start a battle leve. I could go on about how it's not that inconvenient because it's on the way out to the camp anyway.. but it wouldn't make the feature make any more sense.

Just because the guild is in Gridania doesn't mean that other city states don't requests for items to be crafted. (if I wanted to buy a new TV I wouldn't request one from my local butcher)

You're right. While we're at it, let's take out the NPC vendors from the cities - it people want something, they can just go to the city that has the appropriate guild. Let's limit the market wards in each city to only sell materials relevant to the guilds there. The guild isn't the end-all be-all of that class. It can exist elsewhere, and should.

So how about a weaver who is also a Con, he will be in Uldah doing his weaving leves and in Gridania doing his Conjurer leves.

So either all leves will be done solo, or the party will consist of all the same two classes. Is that supposed to be a good thing?

Gladitor guild is in Ul'dah and BSM & ARM guild is in Limsa, It would even out perfectly.

And the conjurer's guild is in Gridania, but the weaver's guild is in Ul'dah. It doesn't even out perfectly. One example of something kind of making sense isn't great support for unnecessary restrictions on all classes.

SE could further ease this problem by making all marketwards linked across cities so that people didn't have to worry about not being able to find the items they are after.

I completely agree with this, I'd love it if this happened. However, it flies in the face of everything you've said up to now. After all, by your logic, why is someone buying a fishing rod in Ul'dah in the first place? The guild isn't there, so they have no business fishing in that area. They should know that fishermen go to Limsa Lominsa, end of story. You see, I love the above idea because it's all about making things more accessible, and I'm all for that. And it's the same reason I disagree with everything else - when it comes to leves, you don't like that universal access, and I just don't understand why.

Further more right now everyone (and i mean everyone) gathers in Ul'dah so we need some way of spreading out people into other cities and giving Limsa and Gridania a purpose.

I go to Gridania all the time. It yields different materials when gathering. I like the look of it. And when I exhaust particular leves elsewhere, it has others for me. I just don't go there for the market wards, just as most people don't. And that's because of the lack of universal access. I don't want to extend that problem to leves.

I think the problem is that you're taking the FFXI approach to this issue - nerf everything until people play the way you want them to. Personally, I think that's a terrible way to go about it. There should be benefits for doing things a certain way - guild marks are a perfect example of that - but you shouldn't be punished for (much less restricted altogether from) doing it another way. I'm not claiming to have the answer to it, but I think there are better ways of spreading people to other cities that don't involve arbitrary restrictions. And you know what, with the market ward access in every city, people would probably just spread out a bit more anyway.

Ugh, sorry this was so long, but I really think it's an important conversation to have. And maybe I'm way off base, and someone can set me straight.

[Arcell]

Again, off-topic. Back to the real matter at hand, leve availability for crafters and gathrers sucks.

I just picked up gathering again because I figured with the new leve system and Chocobos it would be much more bearable. However grabbing 2 leves for a single city, riding out to the camp, doing them and then Returning to the city isn't much better. I can keep doing this for an extended period of time sure but I spend a lot more time running around than I do actually finishing the leves.

[AamesxDavid]

Again, off-topic. Back to the real matter at hand, leve availability for crafters and gathrers sucks.

My entire post was about leve availability for crafters and gatherers... It's fine if you didn't read it, as it was really long and not directed at you.. but don't just assume that it was off-topic.

I just picked up gathering again because I figured with the new leve system and Chocobos it would be much more bearable. However grabbing 2 leves for a single city, riding out to the camp, doing them and then Returning to the city isn't much better. I can keep doing this for an extended period of time sure but I spend a lot more time running around than I do actually finishing the leves.

I'm glad you brought this up, because everyone seemed to think (and maybe some still do) that airships and chocobos would make all the travel issues in the game disappear. But as you say, you're still spending more time running around handing in crafting leves than you are actually crafting for them. And there's no sugar coating it - that's just plain stupid.

I like the idea of handing materials into the guild, but I don't want to make that restrict leves to the city with the proper guild. Maybe the NPC vendor for that guild in each city could take care of it.

[Arcell]

Well it would be fine if I could pick up 4-8 gathering or crafting leves for my level range AT THE SAME TIME. Currently with gathering it's actually impossible for a single class to find 8 leves in their level range in all cities. If I could fill up my list with leves and go out and do them all at once it would be completely different but running back and forth between the city and the camp every 2 leves starts to get boring pretty quickly.

[Castix]

I actually don't mind having to travel around to deliver leves (although I do wish there was more fun to do than simply walk/ride here and turn in). I don't like having to zigzag back and forth for so many of them though. As a result, I have often not bothered to take leves that would drag me to a camp I had otherwise no other reason to visit (such as Camp Bluefog for example). I really don't want to head out in the middle of nowhere just to turn in 1 leve. If I also had battlecraft leves to do there, other quests, other interesting content to do as well - then yes, I would not mind the trip so much.

I am hoping that as they redesign things more, they will also add more to do at all those additional camps that currently have almost no reason to exist.

I think it would be neat if when delivering to those remote locations, there was a chance of an extension to the leve. For example, you finish an alchemist leve that required you to make potions and needs to be turned in at Camp Bluefog. What if there was a chance when turning it in to choose to extend it to a point where you have to run the potions out to a wounded NPC (or even another player) for extra rewards or Guild Marks?

Of course it would be hard to implement from a programming perspective, but at least crafting would be a little more exciting.

[Fayette]

For crafting I would even suggest further refining the system by having it only issue leves that are appropriate for the level of your craft. For example, if you're level 32 it should offer Level 30 and 35 leves but not 1-25. Once you hit 35 it should stop offering the 30 leves and offer 35 and 40 if you should be brave enough to try them. I can't think of a good reason for a crafter to do leves far under their level range.

I have to disagree with this idea. You say there is no reason for a Level 40+ to do any leves that are L35 and below but that just isn't true. As a L50 Weaver and Leatherworker and the changes in the crafting system and the changes in leve rewards, I am finding myself pulling all the leves just to get the harder to get materials.

Even though I am a L50 Botanist, it doesn't mean I always have time to go spend an hour or so to harvest Flax before I start making the equipment I want to. So I just grab a couple of the lower level Weaver leves, do them and then go turn them in for Flax x12 per leve turn in. Same with Fleece x12 and Boar Skins/Peiste/Raptor x2 per leve turn in.

I don't want the option of being able to grab those leves to quickly do for a few materials in a hurry taken away from the crafters. So with all that said, I have to disagree with that idea on being limited on what my leve selection will be just because I am now L45 and that means I shouldn't get to grab leves that are L1-30/35. What I use my leve allowances for should always be my choice, they just need to add more leve choices in the 30+ range and especially in the 40+ area where it gets very hard to level up at a decent pace.

Battle classes have no shortage of leves in their different Levels in all the cities. SE just has to even the playing field now for DoH / DoL.