What is Zodiark?

[Kallera]

Before 3.1 hits, Is there any definitive idea on what Zodiark is other than a divine being the ascians serve and want to bring back? Is it a mothercrystal like hydelyn(the follow up if this is true being "does it also embody a world?") A being like the Twelve? It certainly seems far from anything lesser.

All i remember is that his arrival is bad, and attempts to bring him forth are bad. But such features also match the twelve. What is it, and is there any lore describing it further?

[Februs]

It's hard to say for certain, but I would wager that he may be a being above the 12. They've introduced him as the opposite force to Hydaelyn, so it would stand to reason that he is at at least that level. Though, in terms of in-game information, we don't really have much to go on. However, FFXIV takes a lot of lore ques from the Ivalice Alliance games (namely FF Tactics and FFXII), so there may be information we can glean from the lore of those games.

In FFXII, Zodiark is named the "Keeper of Precepts." His lore states that he was the "strongest of the scions created by the gods" and that "they feared his growth, so they kept him as a child ... He alone fashions the laws governing all things, and administers punishment in place of the gods. So, he is the Keeper of Precepts, and his authority is absolute." - Take straight from the Official FFXII Guide.

The part about the gods fearing his growth is interesting, because in FFXII the scions that the gods created rebelled against them. Ultima convinced them to turn on their masters, and lead them into conflict. Zodiark was not involved in the rebellion, but It is implied in FFXII that the rebellion may have succeeded if he was. It is also implied that the reason the gods sealed him away and kept him as a child in the first place is because they knew he would be able to tip the scales of the battle had he sided with the scions. What's interesting is that there seems to be some similarities here between FFXIV and FFXII. Zodiark is still sealed, though by who and for what reason is a mystery. However, the agenda of the Ascions seems to give us a hint.

The Ascions continually orchestrate catastrophes because large scale instances of chaos supposedly weaken the bonds that are sealing Zodiark. IF Zodiark is anything like FFXII's version, than we can deduce that the reason these bonds are weakened by conflicts is because they are throwing the balance of the world into whack. Zodiark is compelled by his nature to create balance. The more unbalanced things become, the more Zodiark is needed. Keep in mind as well that the Ascions act as a kind of counter-weight to Hydaelyn and the Scions, so this all kind of fits.

Also, this would explain Elidibus's role. In the original FF Tactics, Elidibus was the name of the Lucavi who summoned Zodiac into battle. In FFXIV he is polite, and claims to serve "the one true god." There's a lot of possibilities here. If Elidibus is telling the truth, than Zodiark may possibly be that god, and that Hydaelyn is some kind of fake.

It's also possible that, similar to FFXII, the gods somehow made Zodiark "wrong" or did not realize that his nature would be counter to their own, and were forced to seal him. For example, if Zodiark is truly interested in maintaining order and is responsible for maintaining the laws that govern "all" things, the gods may fall outside of his perception of equilibrium. Zodiark may see other gods as unnecessary existences or unbalanced in some way, causing them to be at odds. Hence, the gods would have to seal him, since he would no longer be working for them, but against them.The Ascions may have simply discovered this "truth" and seek to free him to make things as they believe they should be.

If that's the case, Elidibus's attitude makes more sense, because he does not seem to think that Zodiark is "evil." He seems to truly believe he is doing the right thing, and accepts that doing some level of evil is necessary for the balance to be restored. The gods that have free reign right now would seem reprehensible, because they are the ones who allowed the world to become so unbalanced in the first place, and forced the Ascions to result to such dramatic measures to try and free their god.

All of this is theoretical, at this point though, because FFXIV has not given any concrete evidence for Zodiark in their own game. This incarnation may be totally different from the Ivalice ones that we have come to know. We'll have to wait and see.

[Anonymoose]

As far as I know, there's nothing concrete other than "the Ascians' god" and "the Darkness." Perhaps I've been taken in by a red herring, I admit in advance, but there are so many references to Ophiuchus (the thirteenth constellation) and Ivalice among the Ascians that I'm curious if, as in the world of Tactics / XII, Zodiark is the youngest - but most powerful - of the gods, who caused reality itself to have to be uprooted and changed before he could allow the Darkness in. It at least answers why the Ascians keep referring to the world before ours, it would have been the world of Gods before our physical world of ever-cycling life and death.

[Rawrz]

It's hard to say for certain, but I would wager that he may be a being above the 12. They've introduced him as the opposite force to Hydaelyn, so it would stand to reason that he is at at least that level. Though, in terms of in-game information, we don't really have much to go on. However, FFXIV takes a lot of lore ques from the Ivalice Alliance games (namely FF Tactics and FFXII), so there may be information we can glean from the lore of those games.

In FFXII, Zodiark is named the "Keeper of Precepts." His lore states that he was the "strongest of the scions created by the gods" and that "they feared his growth, so they kept him as a child ... He alone fashions the laws governing all things, and administers punishment in place of the gods. So, he is the Keeper of Precepts, and his authority is absolute." - Take straight from the Official FFXII Guide.

The part about the gods fearing his growth is interesting, because in FFXII the scions that the gods created rebelled against them. Ultima convinced them to turn on their masters, and lead them into conflict. Zodiark was not involved in the rebellion, but It is implied in FFXII that the rebellion may have succeeded if he was. It is also implied that the reason the gods sealed him away and kept him as a child in the first place is because they knew he would be able to tip the scales of the battle had he sided with the scions. What's interesting is that there seems to be some similarities here between FFXIV and FFXII. Zodiark is still sealed, though by who and for what reason is a mystery. However, the agenda of the Ascions seems to give us a hint.

The Ascions continually orchestrate catastrophes because large scale instances of chaos supposedly weaken the bonds that are sealing Zodiark. IF Zodiark is anything like FFXII's version, than we can deduce that the reason these bonds are weakened by conflicts is because they are throwing the balance of the world into whack. Zodiark is compelled by his nature to create balance. The more unbalanced things become, the more Zodiark is needed. Keep in mind as well that the Ascions act as a kind of counter-weight to Hydaelyn and the Scions, so this all kind of fits.

Also, this would explain Elidibus's role. In the original FF Tactics, Elidibus was the name of the Lucavi who summoned Zodiac into battle. In FFXIV he is polite, and claims to serve "the one true god." There's a lot of possibilities here. If Elidibus is telling the truth, than Zodiark may possibly be that god, and that Hydaelyn is some kind of fake.

It's also possible that, similar to FFXII, the gods somehow made Zodiark "wrong" or did not realize that his nature would be counter to their own, and were forced to seal him. For example, if Zodiark is truly interested in maintaining order and is responsible for maintaining the laws that govern "all" things, the gods may fall outside of his perception of equilibrium. Zodiark may see other gods as unnecessary existences or unbalanced in some way, causing them to be at odds. Hence, the gods would have to seal him, since he would no longer be working for them, but against them.The Ascions may have simply discovered this "truth" and seek to free him to make things as they believe they should be.

If that's the case, Elidibus's attitude makes more sense, because he does not seem to think that Zodiark is "evil." He seems to truly believe he is doing the right thing, and accepts that doing some level of evil is necessary for the balance to be restored. The gods that have free reign right now would seem reprehensible, because they are the ones who allowed the world to become so unbalanced in the first place, and forced the Ascions to result to such dramatic measures to try and free their god.

All of this is theoretical, at this point though, because FFXIV has not given any concrete evidence for Zodiark in their own game. This incarnation may be totally different from the Ivalice ones that we have come to know. We'll have to wait and see.

I like this theory the only thing that makes me question is middy.
What kind of deal did he actually make with hydaelyn?
Maybe middy is Serpens and hydalean is Ophiuchus and together they transcended into the planet. They are both beings without a true physical form that just seem attuned with vast amounts of aether.
Does hydaelyn even know she is not the true keeper of this world and just does what she thinks her job is?

Can't wait until they explain more so we can stop killing ourselves with twists.

Edit after thought:
What if zodiark sealed himself away after or with the twelve, sensing who would balance him with them gone?

If so... could hydaelyn be the world's first primal? A being created in zodiarks image, a beautiful mother Crystal that protects life, swayed by light? it could also be why primals see her as her equal as well. SHE HAS TOUCHED YOU. or ...YOU DARE ENTER MY DOMAIN TAINTED BY THE LIGHT? The twelve are gone and summoning them would only bring a primal version of them as powerful as time from all the prayer poured into them, so they can't balance her. Hydaelyn is unknowingly sucking the life out of the planet and the ascians seek to call Zodiark out of his selfmade prison to stop her.

[Kaiser-Ace]

Ok, wait a second here, <Puts on Darksteelfoil Hat> Alright, Midgardsormr made some kind of pact with Hydaelyn in the Time before Time, He was charged with aiding "Hydaelyn's Chosen One" (The MC WoL) and to guard some kind of seal in Silver Tear Lake.

Ok, from 1.0 we know Midgardsormr made contact with The Twelve during The Divine Era not long after the Creation of Silver Tear Lake. We also know there is some kind of Crystal Under Silver Tear Lake. The Agrius exploding weakened the Seal of Silver Tear Lake enough to unleash large amounts of aether and destabilizing the aetheric flow in Mor Dohna even further and making it possible to summon The Primals (Again?).

So lets say Zodiark WAS sealed by The Gods (Hydaelyn and The Twelve in this case) WHERE was he sealed?

Could it be that the Crystal under Silver Tear Lake is actually Zodiark, That the Lake Seal is His Binding, and Midgardsormr arrived on Hydaelyn DURING the sealing of Zodiark and said Sealing is what made the Lake out of the Aetheric Well it supposedly poured out of, thus causing Hydaelyn to charge Midgardsormr with protecting the seal over the now bound God in exchange for allowing him and his Seven Eggs to dwell there?

Well, I guess we'll just have to wait for 3.xx to find out since the Devs said all would be revealed in the 3.xx story cycle.

[Kotemon]

Remember the Relic Weapons?

They all got their form and name after slaying a greater demon called Zodiacs.. Absorbing the aura through their blood gave the weapons sapience and their glow as well.

The final stages of the quest line was to recreate that effect through the use of those four KI's, (Zodium included) and the mahatma.

My running hypothesis is either the Ascians and Zodiac demons were the same beings in a different age, and that Zodiark is the main source that they all spawn from. Or that Zodiark and Hylelyn are the same being or at least two halves of the same singular entity. Where one can never exist without the other, yet both are at odds with each other. Possibly over with what that lore was about with Silver Tear Lake and Midgardsormir. If so than I would also assume Zodiark would also have a pact with a elder dragon like Midgard. The only thing I can think of would be something like Shinryu being the antithesis to Midguard. There's nothing to support this other than a cliché of fiction. With everything being planned out into 4.0 we just need to wait and see what happens.

[Februs]

Snip.

One thing we do know about Middy is that he was charged with guarding a seal that was placed on silver tear lake.

Why he was guarding it is unknown, though it has been widely assumed it is because that is part of the deal he made with Hydaelyn. The exact reason as to why Hydaelyn wanted it kept sealed, though, is not 100% clear.

Why his preferred method of "guarding it" was to take a nap on top of it, is also unknown (seems like a crummy guard dog, if you ask me).

Why he woke and became involved in the battle with the Garleans is also unknown.

It would have seemed more logical for him to have not gotten involved, as the Garleans had no agenda involving the lake and would have likely just flown right by to kill and conquer Eorzea. After all, even if the Garleans had known what was sealed in the lake, they would not have been interested in it. They don't exactly have a high opinion of "false gods." Nor would they have wanted to put a loaded gun into the hands of every beast tribe that they would eventually have to deal with when invading Eorzea... though, one possible reason for why he became involved with the explicit purpose of interfering with the battle in order to protect Hydaelyn's champions from certain defeat and death, as per his contract. Given the end result, though, I'd say he failed miserably at that bit.

What we don't know is if that role is restricted to guarding, and if that guarding extended to keeping tabs on the state of Zodiark. It is entirely possible that Middy also served as a early warning system for Zodiark's awakening, a first line of defense against it, or had nothing to do with it at all. It's hard to say. However, given the Ascion's plans to create as much wanton destruction as possible with the goal of releasing Zodiark, it would seem that the seal requires destruction of some variety in order to break, similar to the one Middy was guarding.

Hydaelyn is also an interesting character, as we don't really know much about her and she seems to have an apparent lack of character. Notice that Hydaelyn's dialogue is almost exclusively restricted to the same lines repeated over and over. The instances of her actually speaking are far and in between, and she rarely says anything overly revealing about herself or her goals. She also tends to ignore other echo users. On frequent occasions, Minfilia pleas with Hydaelyn to speak with them and give them wisdom, only to be met with silence and inaction ... It makes me awfully suspicious about what her agenda in all this is.

[Februs]

Snip.

This is entirely possible, but a few things make me thing otherwise.

Moving with the assumption that the gods are the ones who sealed Zodiark (based on Ivalice lore and... really, who else could have done it?) I would be interested to know what Midgardsormr's role in it was, if any. There seems to be an awful lot of similarities between the seal in Silver Tear Lake and Zodiark. However, there are some key differences.

Firstly, the sheer amount of destruction that the Agrias did and that which the Ascions attempt are hardly comparable. It would seem that whatever seals bind Zodiark are substantially stronger and require much larger destructive forces.

Also, the type of destruction and it's target seem less focused. The Ascions don't seem to have a targeted location for the destruction they wish to cause. They encourage primals to pop up all over the land, and Bahamut's calamity leveled the Carteneu Flats as well as the outlying areas, not silver tear. This leads me to believe that whatever seals bind Zodiark may be similar to those which were in effect within the lake, but not the same. They seem to be more of a cosmic nature, as the Ascions goals are more involved with "balance" and general chaos.

The fact that Zodiark is being played out to be Hydaelyn's opposite also makes me believe that he exists on a more cosmic plane. As Hydaelyin is often represented in cutscenes as the Mother Crystal floating in space, it's more than likely that Zodiark exists in a similar fashion. The question is, where? My first instinct was to say somewhere in The Void, as it seems to be the closest place we've been in the game that acts as the opposite to Hydaelyin's domain. That being said a more radical thought has struck me...

Assuming that Zodiark was sealed in a similar fashion to the Primals (in a crystal, or using a crystal as a seal), I find it interesting that Hydaelyn herself is represented by a massive crystal. This presents two possibilities to me. The first is that the "Mother Crystal" we see when speaking to Hydaelyn is actually the prison that was fashioned for Zodiark. It's possible that Zodiark's powers were so great that Hydaelyn herself had to use her own body as a means of subduing him. This would mean that the reason the Asicions are attempting to cause so much destruction to Hydaelyn's world is to break Hydaelyn herself. They want to cause Hydaelyn enough pain to make her crack and release their god. Scary thought.

The second possibility is that Hydaelyn's representation reflects Zodiarks (as they are opposites). This would imply that Hydaelyn is also subdued within her own confinement. In effect, both her and Zodiark are sealed to some extent. It would explain why she seems to lack character and is extremely limited in her own interactions with her world. She relies on her champions and echo users to do things for her, similar to the way that Zodiark relies on Ascions. This theory would also explain Elidibus's previous absence.

When he first shows up he makes a comment (which I can't quite remember at the moment) about how something has changed in his absence. Where was he? It seems likely that Elidibus was with Zodiark, speaking with him in broken dialogue much the same way Hydaelyn speaks with us. This would imply that Zodiark is capable of communicating on some level into our physical world. Presumably he has only spoken to Elidabus, but who knows? Maybe he'll speak to us one day? Maybe he should be able to, because of the Echo, but cannot because Hydaelyn has claimed us as her own (similar to the way a Primal tempers a subject) and is preventing us from hearing his voice?

This is all purely speculative, obviously, but very interesting in terms of what may or may not be happening in our little corner of the galaxy.

[Kuwagami]

his arrival is bad

Just to point out that this isn't entirely correct.

Zodiark's arrival is bad for Hydaelyn. We do not know to which extent it would affect the world, though if we are to trust the Ascians's words, it would return to its original state, whichever it was. I would most probably be bad for a large par of living beings though.

Thing is, Zodiark's return may not mean that Hydaelyn is forced to disappear. Elidibus gives me the impression that he wants both up together, in a balance of Light and Darkness.

[Enkidoh]

Also do not forget that Hydaelyn Herself actually hinted that Zodiark is already existing somewhere in another realm (the Void?) - She states this in the cutscene after

freeing Thancred from Lahabrea's control:

Hydaelyn: "Hear. Feel. Think."
Hydaelyn: "Warrior of Light. Beloved <son/daughter>."
Hydaelyn: "The Darkness hath fled before the unclosed brilliance of thy spirit."
Hydaelyn: "Yet it lingereth still beyond the sight of men, in forgotten corners of the world."
Hydaelyn: "In the depths of the abyss yet resideth the Dark One, watchful ever."
Hydaelyn: "Till this evil be cast out, never shall the world know aught but a passing peace."

Specifically, Hydaelyn's comment definitely seems to suggest a doggered duality between the two, which would also make Eldibus's statement about "balance needing to be restored" actually strike true (and also contradicting the other Ascians previous comments about bringing about Zodiark's "rebirth").

But either way, as Moose said, Zodiark's true identity is a big blank at this stage - is it that 'dark Hydaelyn/Mothercrystal' seen through the Echo at the very end of the 2.0 ending scene, is it that weird, vaguely humanoid crystalline statue... thing... Nabrieles strung Minfilia up in front of in the Chrysalis, or, paraphrasing what my Path Companion said way back in 1.0, "is it something else? Something we are yet to see? Something, more?"