BRDs not using WM -_-

[Pooky_Pasha]

stuff

WM doesn't suck, the player using it would be the part of the equation that sucks. Also, if the dungeon is taking 45 minutes, that group has more issues with damage than a single BRD not using WM.

[Underlord]

I had a lvl 50 brd pre HW, n neglected to bring it to 60 because of the complaints of WM. But recently I decided, wth let's try. In my perspective its not nearly as bad as everyone makes it out to be. I put up good numbers as well. Granted not numbers like a drg or blm, but good enough where im not a hindrance n helPing. So if people aren't using it at all... they simply don't know what they are doing

[AxelDH]

Well I just got WM when i hit 52 a couple of weeks ago, and in my opinion it's useless as tits on a bull without EA, IJ and the level 60 skill. Y'know cast times, no auto attack, totally borked procs.... >.<
I've always been the sort to stand still more often than not so that's not an issue. So I'm just trying to level up to 60 for the full kit...maybe then I'll like my bard again

At level 52, in terms of single target DPS, you probably wont benefit much without EA/IJ. But Minuet is good to use during the trash pulls, where you will be multi-dotting and using Rain of Death procs, and/or Quick Nock. The loss of auto attacks is pretty insignificant in AOE situations.

[Claire_Pendragon]

Slight derail.

First of, no one can play 110%, you can´t do more than you are able to do.

Technically, he didn't say that, he said

other dps are forced to play 110% more then their usual to make up for the lack of dps from one..

So if their usual is 40% of what they are capable, then it is possible to add more.
(Most of the time, when people used to use the phrase "give it a 110%" they didn't mean surpass your physical limits. But as time went on, the phrase was used with exaggeration, and started to actually mean it with some or most people.)

[Tharian]

If you see a bard/machinist not using their stance AT ALL then by all means kick them. You kick tanks that don't hold aggro and healers that can't heal so there is no reason not to kick dps that won't use their stuff.

I was recently in a Party where the Ninja was ONLY using Spinning Edge and absolutely NOTHING else. This was in a post level 50 dungeon. Yeah we kicked that Ninja after the first couple of fights when we realized that the guy was being utterly useless for us.

Basic principle here applies with every class, if the individual in question isn't willing to use all of their skills to the benefit of the Party, and it inadvertently leads to problems for the rest of the party, then that lack of utility on the individuals part qualifies as a low level version of harassment and you CAN kick them for it, especially if it ends up getting your party K.O.'d during a Boss Fight or something to that effect.

As an alternative example, this one being where the DPS was doing his job TOO well... I was in the "Ward Up" Guildhest with this Summoner who had Ifrit-Egi summoned, and had the Egi on "Sic" (even "Obey" would be a problem here) and was absolutely refusing my request to dismiss the Egi so it wouldn't continuously Auto-Attack the Gargoyle's to death prematurely. I was on my healer at the time, and basically stopped healing the party completely so we could be forced out of combat so that the party could Vote Dismiss the stupid Summoner and get a replacement that would work with the party better. That is seriously one of the most annoying Guildhests in existence to go into with a Summoner who won't listen to directions.

Speaking as a person who is just one level off from 60 on my own Bard, I can't help but feel that people are over-stressing the issues with Wanderer's Minuet. The Cast Times are ONLY 1.5 seconds long at the most, which is a full second shorter than any other casting class except the Machinist with Gauss Barrel activated. We still have one of the highest rates of mobility in the game, it isn't like we suddenly became Black Mages by any means. If it really bothers you, then you can very easily just take to "Stance Hopping," since unlike several other classes with Stances we can change our stance mid-battle.

[RiceisNice]

Even without WM, a BRD can still do fairly good number assuming they play their job well. If they alone are prolonging the run by 45 minutes, then you'd also need to look at the other dps, or consider the fact that even WM it would not have helped, because you will actually do less damage in WM if you don't use the new abilties or otherwise just spam heavy shot. If they're really doing the latter (spamming heavy shot), then they should've really been booted out on that basis. I'm not the sort of person that'll carry someone who can't even be arsed to do their role effectively.

[Ryythe]

If WM works like GB, it's not always in your interest to keep it up 100% of the time. On the other hand, if your BRDs aren't even turning it on, that's pretty terrible.

Also, sight unseen, there's a high probability those BRDs are undergeared like mad, so even if they did use WM they'd still be dead weight. WM isn't so much of a DPS boost that you'd go from 4 to 2 if your weapon is still i90.

Except if it is like GB then you do want it up 100%....

[Aomine1992]

Thanks for the feed back guys a lot of you understand what I'm trying to convey....

I'm just trying to point out that it doesn't need to always be used but at least use it once or twice cause I'm sure everyone would have a fit if the other dps did not keep up their buffs I.e. BOTD, Huton, Enochian, Chakara(not really a buff lol), using DWT, it's not a big deal until the rest of the party has to pick up the slack it's a little unfair that's all.

[Aiselia]

@topic:

Maybe, just maybe, those people are among the Bards on this forum who complained about how they hate the cast times of WM and were told on this forum "just don't use it" because "nobody relies on the Bard for DPS".

Out of curiosity, and I'm pretty sure the honest answer is going to be no, have you ever bothered to ask them directly why they're not using it? Or did you skip to just asking completely unrelated people here to speculate on why random people may not want to use WM?

So if their usual is 40% of what they are capable, then it is possible to add more.
(Most of the time, when people used to use the phrase "give it a 110%" they didn't mean surpass your physical limits. But as time went on, the phrase was used with exaggeration, and started to actually mean it with some or most people.)

Of course, anyone that isn't playing at 100% of their capability at all times doesn't have a right to complain about a Bard not using WM because a slacker shouldn't complain about slackers.
So it's actually far safer to assume that their usual is 100% of their capability because anything less is hypocrisy.

[Ryythe]

Thanks for the feed back guys a lot of you understand what I'm trying to convey....

I'm just trying to point out that it doesn't need to always be used but at least use it once or twice cause I'm sure everyone would have a fit if the other dps did not keep up their buffs I.e. BOTD, Huton, Enochian, Chakara(not really a buff lol), using DWT, it's not a big deal until the rest of the party has to pick up the slack it's a little unfair that's all.

Except you do need to use it 100% of the time.