parse for ps4 users !

[Kallera]

I really don't know about the idea. All i know is the second it is given, there won't be a way to go back on it. And if the future of my time with the game is going to be rife with dps measuring contests and the parser being used as a bludegeon, It just won't feel right.

[Jamein]

I really don't know about the idea. All i know is the second it is given, there won't be a way to go back on it. And if the future of my time with the game is going to be rife with dps measuring contests and the parser being used as a bludegeon, im out.

Dunno how many times it has been said, unless you're doing savage most people really don't care what your DPS is unless its so abysmal that its causing the raid to fail, in which case you have to ask yourself is it fair to go into DF as a DPS class and hold back 7 other people? Or can you just go learn a basic rotation. I can honestly see a lot more good coming from parsers than the bad.

[sirDarts]

I really don't know about the idea. All i know is the second it is given, there won't be a way to go back on it. And if the future of my time with the game is going to be rife with dps measuring contests and the parser being used as a bludegeon, It just won't feel right.

How many mediocre tanks are getting bashed for losing some aggro as long as it doesn't cause a wipe?
How many mediocre healers are getting bashed for letting someone die, or for letting a debuff on someone for too long as long as it doesn't cause a wipe?
That's the max amount of mediocre DPS that might get bashed as long as it doesn't cause a wipe.

[Kallera]

How many mediocre tanks are getting bashed for losing some aggro as long as it doesn't cause a wipe?
How many mediocre healers are getting bashed for letting someone die, or for letting a debuff on someone for too long as long as it doesn't cause a wipe?
That's the max amount of mediocre DPS that might get bashed as long as it doesn't cause a wipe.

Because the idea of what is mediocre will get wider. And people will attempt to either enforce that in their parties or discourage what they call "carrying" those that don't meet their standards. Some may even suggest it here.

Im not denying the use of parsers, but the widespread prevalence of their numbers is unnerving.

[Totobi]

People just don't want to be held accountable for being bad and getting carried. That's the only thing i can take from people disagreeing with parsers.

"But people will harass others over parses!" Not if you take a tiny bit of damn effort to learn how to play the role you picked.

[Azazua_azura]

snipe

I'm not even saying that. I just know from experience what happens when ingame parser is added, ppl have e-peen constest on who can top dps

@ sirdarts

What you are failing to understand is the replies you the questions. As any raider keeps forgetting, you can't factually say people don't care about dps/how well people play in DF. From personal experience people do care. I was also stating personal opinion. People keep stating their is nothing to aid in their improvement, when that isn't true. Infact how parser get their data is where it comes from, the battle log.

@ jamain

my info/stuiff has never been about raiding, but the wish/will to improve your class. All a parser does it make the battke log info "easier to read" << subjective. Also your mixing up rotattion with adpaptation not your rotation isn't really changing persay but you are picking what part you use due to the mobs movements

Also I raided in ff11 for a lil but this was before windower and parser might i add, and people was clearing content, and the raids I did ha did have dps checks, as did some hnm. Alot of the prime avatar fights were a dps check cuz prior to gear additions all hell broke loose after the avatar used their 2 hr. Infact 1 raid syustem in ff11 called dynamis was initself a dps check cuz you had a limit time to clear it before you existed with only geting a few time exstentions. Pretty much you had to kill waves of mobs + mini boss mobs to pop the main boss which had to be kills or raid was a bust now granted this was before enrage timers were added in ff11,



and the argument is more people picking between a hammer and a nailgun

If you gonna use some non game related anology try to make sure you use a correct one Parser data come from the battle log, which does have chat log text connected to it. Parser just amakes the info "easier to read" by collectively presenting it as a damage per second ratio.

Also you do kinda gotta understansd that alot of ppl did infact comre from WoW which had crazy addons, which did infact tell you how to play. Ones that told you ur rotation for any given fight/spec, one told you where to stand in certain bosses/ mechanics, ones that told you to not stand in fire.

People got used to those addons and possible not used to playing w/o them here.

Also do kee-p in mind that I do know what I am talking about, i just have a hard time expressing it cuz of my Austism spectrum stuff. :/

Not fun, trying to share my opinion or give sound advice (which isn't bad advice as that was how this were done in early gaming) and being treated like crap over it.

The thing is though if you add tools to the game people will use them, it wouldn't matter if it was df, pf, raid content,non-raid content. People will use it to exclude players they find as bad in the eyes of what the tool says. It does happen already, I can't tell you how many times I have seen people kicked or belittled about how they play even when content is being cleared. Like i said before I was kicked out of neverreap though we was clearing it when i didn't put dots on 1 mob set.

I was put on blast as a fresh tank for not pulling fast enough.

You guys need to go back to history class on how humans think, we have no trouble excluding anyone for any reason.
It is also in poor taste to witch hunt people for "being carried" as long as the person isn't afk that are participating.

For me personally numbers in a game are arbitrary, as long as the mobs hp goes down at a decent rate i could care less about each party members personal dps.

the only thing that bugs me is when players are undergeared or use off role gear. (more talking archers with mage gear) which is basics of rpg. And even then i try to be nice about it abd only kick the person if they have a bad attitude.

Dps comes from an multiple factors: gear, stats, experience. Players who put out high numbers are those who are well geared, have good understanding of their job/role, and know the content extremely well. As in they are geared for the content know what to use, when to use it. They know when and where to dodge for all attacks.'

Players who pull low number's chances are they are still learning their job/role, still learning the content. But also some other factores as their net speed/ system set up may not be the greatest. In worst case senario, they are trolling or lazy.

I don't want ingame parser because I do not want to see the community turn into WoWs or DCUO or heck ff11 from 2009-2011, and become exlusionary even in df content, which would happen, anyone who denies this fact really shelters themselves from the rest of the community or didn't play enough mmo to notice.

And for me, i DISPISE being "carried" i think it is a hit in the taco to be carriedn, cuz i pride myself in being a gamer.

@ jamein

just a quick bit of info, you can't really judge the "top raiders" as "top dps" << subjective. For all you know the top dos players are non raiders on console, and just simply don't give a dam. Just because i don't use a parser (though i have used 1 before which you kinda keep missing) doesn't mean i don't know how they work. Thing is anything user-made is up to scrutiny. For all you know every parser you ever used has been incorrect based on improper coding, i personally would never take anything user made for face value.
Proof of that has been found from incorrect calculations of stat caps, to different parsers giving different numbers.

I rather get my info from the official battle log text over unofficial parser.

[sirDarts]

Because the idea of what is mediocre will get wider. And people will attempt to either enforce that in their parties or discourage what they call "carrying" those that don't meet their standards. Some may even suggest it here.

Im not denying the use of parsers, but the widespread prevalence of their numbers is unnerving.

What I call mediocre, and would likely not change, is people who are not doing their jobs up to some sort of standard (tanks fully holding aggro, healers not removing DoTs/Debuffs or letting someone die), but still not causing a wipe.
People already now don't care even about BLATANT lack of DPS, as long as content is getting cleared (I have met ice mages where nobody said a thing for example).

Only once content is not getting cleared people mind.

[Xenon_S]

Some idea as to how to implement it while minimizing harassment induction
I imagine integrated parsers to be a long ways off due to UI memory restrictions, just look at what they did with the TP bar

Before everything else, the official parser, by default, can only view your own data, and not others without permission

1. DPS Parses should be personal with 2 settings: simple and advanced
- The simple mode gives no numbers and is just a colour indicator that takes into account of your current gear level and gives you a letter grade as a simple feedback on how you performed
- The advanced mode would be similar to the ACT interface outputting straight numbers
I don't support the idea of just turning the personal parser off (for dps) classes, the simple mode is meant for those who does not want to deal with numbers, and it stays there by default to tell the lazy/clueless dps to step up the game, as many have said, getting carried is not acceptable and they should be made aware of that

2. Have an option to make your dps parse data viewable to members in the party, only players with this option activated can see the other party member's dps should they choose to turn on the same option
There should be a prompt saying, "by turning on the public parser, you agree to behave yourself, the data provided is solely purposes for combat coordination and feedback, harassment is a reportable and ban able offence "
- here is an example in a 4 man dungeon
Tank and dps A have the public parser option turned on
The healer and dps B have the said option turned off
The tank and dps A will be able to see each other's dps on the interface, but cannot see the healers or the dps B's parse data
In event where 2 or more part members turned public parse on, the remaining dps will be given a prompt to activate the same option
They can still choose to refuse to do so, that alone cannot constitute for the player to be vote kicked
However, if the dps without public parser is doing abysmal dps, it will be displayed to the party regardless of the players wishes and can be vote kicked should the party decides to

3. Queuing options for
- no public parsers: everyone queued into the instance will by default have the public parser turned off, and it will stay off for the entire duration of the instance, aimed for those 'I don't care I don't want to care players', or rather, to minimize conflict by quarantine them away from those who actually want to try
- public parse neutral: everyone queued into the instance will retain their current public parser settings with the option to turn it off/on anytime throughout the instance, this is by default checked
- public parser exclusive: this option is available for those who try to output good effort

4. An one click harassment report function needs to be integrated
Should a player be harassed for low dps when they have NOT made their parse public, this indicates the harasser using 3rd party parser.
The one click report snapshots the party members' public parse settings, as well as takes a chunk of the chat log and send to GM
Offender will be warned and banned


Though I do realize this can create segregations in the player base and lengthen queue times depending on options. The solution against potential harassment is one that's punishment based that could feel to be an iron hammer approach.
Maybe there needs to be a system which incentivize pleasant behaviour and good performance aside from player commendations

[melisande]

How about they just do a mass ban wave of all you parser users? That would be great. Looking forward to it.

[Archaell]

How about they just do a mass ban wave of all you parser users? That would be great. Looking forward to it.

Do you know what would happen if they did this? Just think about it.