parse for ps4 users !

[whiskeybravo]

If they were to implement in official parsing app, by what logic does it become a tool for harassment? You don't even know how it's going to be implemented.

IMO, the best way to implement it would be just personal dps. Something like a counter, similar to the gil counter, just a HUD element that can be moved around with a digital read out of dps at that moment. Additional feature would be a battle report that you can view after an instance/encounter that breaks down damage dealt, encounter time, things like crit rate or skill usage would be cool, relevant information that competes with 3rd party apps.

To minimize harassment there are 2 things: the only thing visible while in the encounter is your own dps meter. The battle report after the instance could be limited to your own damage, or it could show the groups numbers with names erased and only showing the role. That way it would be more difficult to harass someone after the fact (though, there is still the chat log and stuff that might show peoples name afterwards).

They only really need to develop something for ps4. It wouldn't be that advantageous to develop a PC app. For one, PC apps are free. SE would have to do everything the free apps can do, and hopefully a bit more, to get users to stop using 3rd party apps and use the official one. For PS4 there is no competition. They can sell us something (and I'd be willing to pay $15-20) that only gives the most basic of information. We need to give them some idea of how much could be earned vs the cost of design/implementation. If we could get enough ps4 users from enough servers to say, "vote on this link if you'd pay $10-20 for an official ps4 damage app", then we can help SE can weigh development cost vs ROI and maybe they can get something moving on it.

[MentheusDreyar]

Snip.

Except that doesn't really solve anything in context to group performance, especially PUGs. Unless i'm in a full party of people i know and trust a personal parser is practically useless in group content.

No one is going to be truthful about their numbers out of fear of being kicked/harassed. In the end it needs to be a full parser and not a half-assed attempt at a DPS meter otherwise the feedback is very situational and people will continue to use a 3rd party alternative to find out the real problem.

By all means they can implement their instanced personal parser for rotation testing, etc. but it will be useless for any actual group content because nothing is out in the open, we can't see the changes in peoples DPS/heals in real time as the situation changes, we can't judge what's causing the issue. We'll have virtually the same information we have now, which is next to nothing and that "something" is wrong.

[whiskeybravo]

Except that doesn't really solve anything in context to group performance, especially PUGs. Unless i'm in a full party of people i know and trust a personal parser is practically useless in group content.

No one is going to be truthful about their numbers out of fear of being kicked/harassed. In the end it needs to be a full parser and not a half-assed attempt at a DPS meter otherwise the feedback is very situational and people will continue to use a 3rd party alternative to find out the real problem.

By all means they can implement their instanced personal parser for rotation testing, etc. but it will be useless for any actual group content because nothing is out in the open, we can't see the changes in peoples DPS/heals in real time as the situation changes, we can't judge what's causing the issue. We'll have virtually the same information we have now, which is next to nothing and that "something" is wrong.

I'm sure there are a few, but chances are slim you'd find a full 8/8 ps4 static. Even then, what else are they going to be able use? Nothing..

As for harassment, you kind of sound like the government. "No one is going to tell us what their conversations are so we need to tap everyones phone and listen illegally" Lol. Parse police

I just threw out some ideas, doesn't mean it's the complete picture. A little imagination is necessary to find something that would work well and provide enough information to act on one way or the other, while respecting whatever hardware limitations are present with the console. I specifically mentioned it shouldn't try to replace existing 3rd party apps for PC. But right now there is nothing on ps4, so just about anything would be an improvement.

And just as an aside. ACT hasn't told our group one thing about why we are wiping in A3S, it can't correct human errors :P

[MentheusDreyar]

I'm sure there are a few, but chances are slim you'd find a full 8/8 ps4 static. Even then, what else are they going to be able use? Nothing..

As for harassment, you kind of sound like the government. "No one is going to tell us what their conversations are so we need to tap everyones phone and listen illegally" Lol. Parse police

I just threw out some ideas, doesn't mean it's the complete picture. A little imagination is necessary to find something that would work well and provide enough information to act on one way or the other, while respecting whatever hardware limitations are present with the console. I specifically mentioned it shouldn't try to replace existing 3rd party apps for PC. But right now there is nothing on ps4, so just about anything would be an improvement.

And just as an aside. ACT hasn't told our group one thing about why we are wiping in A3S, it can't correct human errors :P

My static is 6/8 PS4 players and they rely on me for our parsing, if i wasn't in there they'd have no feedback whatsoever, which is why we need a parser of some form at least, i agree on that. But a straight up DPS meter only tells you one thing, it won't tell you healPS, outgoing heals, incoming damage, etc. All necessary when you're trying to be as efficient as possible.

Haha i wouldn't take it that far but there's no way i'd believe possible falsified data by players unwilling to share in the first place, especially when they are wasting 3+ other peoples time. The average person would to anything do protect themselves, and it only gets worse online

But that's the problem, we need more than just DPS data, healer's could be under healing and causing wipes, with a full parser we'd be able to see how much damage is going out and when so healer's can prepare for it, we can see where DPS will fall because we have to deal with adds and mechanics and how we can reduce that DPS loss. None of this you'll get from a personal dps meter, and random PUGs probably won't believe a single player's data if they are the only one parsing.

And of course a tool can't predict and tell you human errors, it does have it's limitations like everything, but it'll get you 90% of the way there easily. The rest comes down to skill, luck and RNG

I guess my point is... If it's at all technically possible to have a full parser in-game we absolutely need that. If it's too much for consoles to handle or server limitation's prevents that much info being shared then just a DPS meter will suffice for general content, but it needs to be shared to everyone in the party. Otherwise there is no point in bothering at all and nothing will ever change and bad players will continue to be kicked because we can't legally help them without risking a ban ourselves and it's not like DPS are precious for anything. Hidden numbers causes player ignorance and laziness in the end.

[ShanaShirayuki]

I like how the Anti-Parser crowd still hasn't given an answer for why tanks/healers are held to a higher standard while DPS get a free pass on suboptimal performance (especially when there is content outside of raid environments that have DPS checks).

[Ryel]

I like how the Anti-Parser crowd still hasn't given an answer for why tanks/healers are held to a higher standard while DPS get a free pass on suboptimal performance (especially when there is content outside of raid environments that have DPS checks).

I keep waiting for this as well

[Archaell]

I like how the Anti-Parser crowd still hasn't given an answer for why tanks/healers are held to a higher standard while DPS get a free pass on suboptimal performance (especially when there is content outside of raid environments that have DPS checks).

"As long as the content gets cleared who cares?" That's the usual answer.

Sometimes I wonder if the dungeons aren't actually made for 3man groups and on top of that without tank's and healer's dps in mind.

[Kosmos992k]

"As long as the content gets cleared who cares?" That's the usual answer.

Sometimes I wonder if the dungeons aren't actually made for 3man groups and on top of that without tank's and healer's dps in mind.

Even with the level sync a 60 in full gear still overgears the basic dungeons by a pretty hefty amount, all your gear an character attributes will be capped out at their max. Imagine how much of an advantage you have in a lvl 35/40 dungeon where your effective ilvl is 5-10 higher than the dungeon level. That's why some have suggested tighter sync of gear and stats. So running them as you are now, for example, probably would feel like they are balanced for 3, not 4. Run them in mid-tier, level appropriate gear though and you'll want that 4th player.

[sirDarts]

"As long as the content gets cleared who cares?" That's the usual answer.

The problem is. Content is NOT getting cleared.
Both Bismarck HM and Ravana HM are failing.
Bismarck is often not even getting cleared within the allocated time. Because people can't get past the double-snake DPS check, and nobody is allowed to know which of the DPS are not pulling their weight. Mind you, that's INCLUDING me putting full Cleric SCH DoTs on both of them every chance I get.

Question -- how are Tanks and Healers rated for performance, except for "I didn't die" and "the tank kept aggro" ? Can we automatically turn off the tanks numbers so we can compare job performance of tanks AS TANKS and healers AS HEALERS and not DPS?

Why does many who advocate an "official parser" seem to believe that the majority of content in this game needs one?

Question -- Would advocates for an "official parser" be satisfied if it was personal. Period.

Whiteroom already said most of what I would, just a few additions.

1) Tanks and Healers are already expected to DPS above their "keep everyone alive", and "hold aggro" baseline.

2) The reason I think majority of content (IMO all group content outside of FATEs) needs one. Not because you need to see who is not pulling their weight in the majority, but because people need to learn gradually how to play their jobs, and they won't if they don't see they are underperforming.
Healers learn to play their job in Hauke at the latest because there can be quite a bit of incoming damage, and status effects.
Tanks learn to play their job in Brayflox at the latest because of the various add phases at the first boss, and the reposition mechanics at the last boss. And also the trash patrols.
There is no place where DPS actually need to perform till Bismarck HM.

3) No, I would not be satisfied with a personal parser. How are you supposed to know that you should be putting out more, if you have no reference? Also it would not help solve issues with content not getting done because people would lie about their numbers.
Also let me tell you, having that goal above you, seeing that someone is doing better and trying to catch up to them, that's something that can really motivate a person.
Not to mention that it's really satisfying to see that you for example pulled almost double your co-healer's HPS, while doing half their overhealing, AND putting out 100 more DPS. :3