useless scholars

[Blessedbythesun]

Personally, outside of the current raid tier, my view is "DPS if you want to/feel comfortable/etc". But, meanwhile, the two sides will rage at each other...

I am with you on that, I do believe it is reasonable for healers to DPS at their discretion. What I don't support is polarization to one side or the other. In this particular case, the assumption that a SCH not DPSing means they are trash and just leeching.

[Eul]

Or you could put some DoT while not in Cleric Stance. People won't notice your damage tho (Unless the parser guy gonna complain about SCH's DPS so low, I don't care IMO)

[LegoTechnic]

I do not like to stand still. If I can shield a tank and then spend 10-15 seconds for dots and broils while the fairy heals then I think that's a valuable use of time. Ideally I think you want to maximize your contribution, and this is in no way unique to SCH's (it's why DPS have openers and rotations). Obviously if your tank is made of paper you will not want to risk a cleric cooldown, but if you are comfortable and an adlo + fairy would allow you to dot + bane or whathaveyou, then it's lax to not take advantage. Even a WHM can regen targets and then blast away for a few rounds in raid settings (and do not underestimate WHM burst, as Stone III > Broil)

But having said that, this is a game, and if a relaxed pace is fun for you then I won't criticize you for it; your foremost priority should be having fun. However, taking advantage of your class and opportunities to do your best is also a way to enjoy the game, and the one I personally prefer. I hate just standing around.

[warren-ragnarok]

why are 90% of scholars in this game adamant on not wanting to dps?

why does sch need to dps to begin with, it should be a completely voluntary thing (yes i dps every now and then on my sch, but i wont scold another for not doing it)

if you are hurting for the extra dps from a sch, the dps in your party need to get good, the content is made so healers dont have to dps, nor tanks, they just "do their jobs"

[Sidra]

why does sch need to dps to begin with, it should be a completely voluntary thing (yes i dps every now and then on my sch, but i wont scold another for not doing it)

if you are hurting for the extra dps from a sch, the dps in your party need to get good, the content is made so healers dont have to dps, nor tanks, they just "do their jobs"

Why should it be voluntary and not mandatory? You didn't make the game, SE did. And in this game about half of healer's kits are dps and they have the ability to contribute meaningful dps to parties while healing. For good gameplay in FFXIV in most content, healer dps is required. If anyone isn't trying are or doesn't care, so be it. But all jobs should try to use their entire ability sets to be the best teammates they can be. I think that's fair to require from my fellow teammates, and they can expect the same from me

[MariaNyan]

You have no idea what you are talking about, the meta says healer must dps, that leads to more wipes than i can count on my fingers.
If you don't feel comfortable or its not within your ability, let it go, srly. Do you mainjob healing first before adding sugar and creme to it, because dead dps/tank is more dps than you can ever contribute to within that time(given that they not entirely sux).

Ofc if you are doing savage that's a different story, but how many are actually doing it well? not many, so leave that be, not every sch you see is a dps-maschine, if you can great, if not don't, nothing to do what the meta says but rather what you can do, and i expect not much from people, so this discussion won't even come up.

[Kabzy]

You have no idea what you are talking about, the meta says healer must dps, that leads to more wipes than i can count on my fingers.
If you don't feel comfortable or its not within your ability, let it go, srly. Do you mainjob healing first before adding sugar and creme to it, because dead dps/tank is more dps than you can ever contribute to within that time(given that they not entirely sux).

That's sort of an irrelevant point, mainly because it's assumed that you are properly fulfilling your primary role as a healer before you start contributing to DPS. As for the DPS contribution, being able to pull 1500+ DPS for the first half of A2S as a SCH is certainly enough of a contribution compared to Tank DPS. ;p Even our WHM was doing around 1200 DPS. Seeing numbers like that really does make you wonder how much of a hinderance those 'heal only' healers could be to a progression group.

[Blessedbythesun]

-snip-

You're talking about endgame raiding for players that make up a very small percentage of the population. The type of content that could actually hinge on healer DPS because Alexander savage has been a massive DPS to begin with. If a designated healer isn't DPSing in savage, something is wrong. But again, that is strictly endgame raiding, which currently makes up 4 instances out of majority of the current content. Your point is irrelevant because the majority of the population of the game aren't playing the limited content that pushes them to play more methodically.

[Kabzy]

-snip-

But if you actually read my post you can see I'm responding to someone who is describing the current 'meta'. The current meta only applies to the 4 instances making up said endgame raiding, and so the point is very much so relevant. I know he then says Savage is different, but I think he's confusing himself because that's what the meta is. All other content is just a repeat of dungeons and other content that even fairies can solo heal.

[Sidra]

You're talking about endgame raiding for players that make up a very small percentage of the population. The type of content that could actually hinge on healer DPS because Alexander savage has been a massive DPS to begin with. If a designated healer isn't DPSing in savage, something is wrong. But again, that is strictly endgame raiding, which currently makes up 4 instances out of majority of the current content. Your point is irrelevant because the majority of the population of the game aren't playing the limited content that pushes them to play more methodically.

Here's the thing though - it's not just Savage. I was solo healing some Ravana runs last night to get weapon for peoples alts and just for fun, and even though I'm a SMN main with healer alts, my 190 SCH was able to add 200 dps while solo healing. And Admittedly, I am not a very good healer. If I was a better player, I am sure I could have done more. And what if a group was doing that with 2 healers...so much time when not healing is needed. When I run 4man dungeons for dailys - I generally do like 500 dps over the whole dungeon. And if I wasn't - I'd be standing there twiddling my thumbs half the time doing nothing. I actually don't know how healers don't dps in dungeons - they must be drinking coffee and reading the news or watching a movie as they are playing.

The times when a healer shouldn't be trying to help dps are extremely limited - maybe while actually leveling with a poorly played or undergeared tank. But that's about it. The vast majority of the content simply doesn't have enough needed healing uptime to make dpsing not pretty much required/beneficial/should be doing it depending on your preferred phrasing for such.

I don't understand why people don't think that all players should be trying to use use their entire skillsets to be the best teammates they can be. I think that's fair to require of your teammates and commit to yourself.

There are a lot of games where healers can't dps while healing, or their damage is so low as to be pointless to try and do so. But FFXIV just isn't one of them. I feel like a lot of players are attempting to take their experience from other games or their personal preference of how they like to play and state it as a reality in FFXIV, when it just simply isn't the case here.