DEV REQUEST: Remove cast bars to MCH & BRD

[Daralii]

Why there are so many different topics about bards current state? Because every single thread gets flooded by anti bards and black mages.

Nothing worse than opposing viewpoints, right?

[ExiaQuanta]

If square is gonna give back brds mobility and take away WM, they will also have to nerf every fight and every class to accommodate the dps checks and to keep the dps ratio between brd and others classes the same. As people have stated before, with WM brds are still behind dps by like 200. But wait, if thats with WM, than wouldnt that mean the gap would be even bigger with out it?? I don't think a potency buff to every of brds skill will fix the gap. If that is the case here, than your lookin at

Mobility + 190 potency Heavy Shot/Bloodletter. 130 potency on venomous bite with a dot potency of 40 potency, 80 potency of windbite with a dot potency of 60 and so on so forth. It all sounds reasonable yea? Cause you need potency around these for brd to do the same dmg as they do now. But the mobility and the idea of ignoring AoEs and still have 100% dps and uptime is the winner here and deal breaker.

[Yoruichi4478]

Or they could look at how other gaming companies really BUFF w/o nerfing other things and their games still have balance. In TERA when archer and some other jobs got buffed so they wouldn't be lesser dps and in some cases a joke to play because of output, they didn't punish the playerbase by nerfing other things and yet the game still retained its balance up until I stopped playing to start back again with ffxiv. Why do brd and mch have to be punished for being ranged when some other gaming companies don't do that and yet their games retain balance? Just a thought.

[Gilraen]

I happen to like Minuet. The pace of actions is like a lazy enmity control, don't have to hold back anywhere near as much when I start plunking buffs. That said, Minuet wasn't something Square gave Bard just because. Bard is every bit as viable without as they are with. Minuet is their answer to players requests for more damage, and more damage it is. But seems Square wasn't exactly anticipating people ONLY wanting more damage, they didn't want it balanced against the other Jobs. "But it's not balanced!" Oh, but it is. Other Jobs may have gotten as many buffs in Heavensward but they arealmost all limited in use and duration... save Minuet. I'm not counting the Extra Jobs cause their thing is being new with Heavensward. But. again, Bard is every bit as viable without Minuet as they are with so if you don't like having to stand still and cast like a Black Mage, then don't use it. Quit talking for others when clearly you don't.

[RiceisNice]

I happen to like Minuet. The pace of actions is like a lazy enmity control, don't have to hold back anywhere near as much when I start plunking buffs. That said, Minuet wasn't something Square gave Bard just because. Bard is every bit as viable without as they are with. Minuet is their answer to players requests for more damage, and more damage it is. But seems Square wasn't exactly anticipating people ONLY wanting more damage, they didn't want it balanced against the other Jobs. "But it's not balanced!" Oh, but it is. Other Jobs may have gotten as many buffs in Heavensward but they arealmost all limited in use and duration... save Minuet. I'm not counting the Extra Jobs cause their thing is being new with Heavensward. But. again, Bard is every bit as viable without Minuet as they are with so if you don't like having to stand still and cast like a Black Mage, then don't use it. Quit talking for others when clearly you don't.

Wat. DPs for all the jobs is balanced around using 3.0 skills to keep the dps discrepancy the same. Bards using WM isnt doing any more damage in 3.0 compared to other classes that are using their 3.0 skills as it was in 2.0. If you were to take off WM, the damage discrepancy would widen and you'd be doing less damage comparatively than it was in 2.0.

It also doesn't control enmity because it doesn't slow down the rate of skills you use. You're still using one skill every 2.5~ seconds due to the GCD.

[Gilraen]

You're still using one skill every 2.5~ seconds due to the GCD.

I don't know, I've found during the last boss of Vault I can kill the orbs faster without Minuet than I can with. As for GCD, yes, it is still 2.5 seconds but with Minuet up there's a 3.5-ish cast time for most actions so GCD is moot at that point. At least, that's what I've noticed, I don't really give it the third-degree so I can't say with utter confidence. Either way, I'm not generating as much enmity with Minuet as I do without because of the extra time between actions. This is one of the trade-offs for doing 30% more damage, a casting time and reduced mobility. This is also the thing alot of the 'everyone' spokespeople seem to hate. Again, there had to be a trade-off in order for it to be balanced.

[rappa]

I don't know, I've found during the last boss of Vault I can kill the orbs faster without Minuet than I can with. As for GCD, yes, it is still 2.5 seconds but with Minuet up there's a 3.5-ish cast time for most actions so GCD is moot at that point. At least, that's what I've noticed, I don't really give it the third-degree so I can't say with utter confidence. Either way, I'm not generating as much enmity with Minuet as I do without because of the extra time between actions. This is one of the trade-offs for doing 30% more damage, a casting time and reduced mobility. This is also the thing alot of the 'everyone' spokespeople seem to hate. Again, there had to be a trade-off in order for it to be balanced.

3.5? what kind of connection have you got?

My cast bars with 528 skill speed are 1'46
With 707 are 1.42

Please don't blame castsbars when the problem is your connection or ISP.

[Gilraen]

Please don't blame castsbars when the problem is your connection or ISP.

What?! I'm... I'm confused. When did I 'blame' anything on anything? I'm reading my posts and I don't see anything saying anything to that effect. I don't really understand where your negativity is stemming from. Anyway, I do notice that the GCD resolves before I'm finished with my action under Minuet whereas without I'm waiting on the GCD in order to use another action. This difference gives a noticeable reduction in enmity build-up, at least I've noticed something to that effect. It's harder for me to pull hate under Minuet than without. But this is all personal experience, everyone has their own.

[RiceisNice]

...

Your cast time is 1.5 seconds in a 2.5 GCD. There's no possible way for you to generate "less" enmnity compared to now, unless you always opened with an auto attack rather than a weapon skill.

It's same as black mages.
You started to cast fire I and you would see fire III proc from the last fire I. (You used surecast - lethargy - virus or another ability to force server update and check the proc before fire I hits. Was useful during 2.4 and beyond before start casting blizzard III to enter umbral ice).

bards are the same, you use bloodletter, blunt arrow, empyreal arrow, sidewinder and all kind of buffs to force server update and check Straigther Shot proc. Sometimes you get the proc when you are casting, it's a crap and would be fixed. The potency lost is 10 against use heavy shot cast vs straight shot cast. You cast SS and you have the proc, no problem. Let ss be casted, use another oGCD, and use against SS proc.

You can't use a oGCd skill to force a server check for SS procs. I mentioned this in a previous post and it doesn't work like that for BRD for god knows why because you can do this just fine for BLM

[rappa]

You mentioned heavy shot cast followed by straight shot cast, then you notice you got ss proc. I said that would be fixed but will be hard like server connection and your game work.

As i said. Cast heavy shot - bloodletter(ss proc appears) - straight shot instant.