The Definitive State of Paladins Thread

[Dhex]

I would like to see more complexity added to PLD on the defensive side, such as more emphasis on reactive defending that then could combo or chain into another ability for cumulative or additional effects. For example the block from Sheltron procs a combo bonus to Shield Swipe that applies a debuff similar to Reprisal (-10% damage done) or something like that.

Augh no welcome back to 1.2 and Paladin being utterly useless. Having to wait for everything to proc Phalanx or blocks to be useful. (Ew I feel back? Bad. For Dark Knight but that's just damage and extra damage down REPPRIIISSALLLLLLL. Dat forced MT role. Thanks Square. Real rigid love it.) Eck. Proactive mitigation - this is why they changed Warrior in 2.1 - because reactive defense doesn't work when you're post-damage recovery =/= damage mitigated. This is part of the reason everyone considers Dark Knight's mitigation clunky having to rely on Parry procs or popping Dark Arts and their cooldown before the buster comes. You can't have "reactive" defending beyond expending cooldowns appropriately - all three WAR DRK PLD they all mitigate the same in that regard - Warriors build/expend stacks and pop CDs, Dark Knights pop Dark Arts and CDs. Paladin is clunky as is adding more requirements to their mitigation is silly.

If Cover was then improved/fixed so that it worked with both physical and magical damage, had greater range, etc., so that a PLD could utilize their defensive capabilities even when OTing, that would add complexity to the class but have it play very differently than WAR or DRK.

Even if they did this - if Paladin isn't completely nullifying damage it's just redirecting where the healing has to go - if it doesn't offer the benefit of additional damage it's not going to be a better choice as off-tank; so then why use a Paladin? Pointless defensive capabilities don't make it more desirable in an off-tanking scenario.

Simple offense, more complex and fun/engaging defense is the direction I feel PLD should go.

So... Warrior.

Tanks do this; Big hit - Use thingy to reduce Big hit! This is what all 3 tanks already do effectively. If they couldn't do this they wouldn't be tanks. Adding gimmicks to "Use thingy" does not inherently change this outside of making it require procs and we all already hate RNG (Parry Block Reprisal Shield Swipe say hallo). Dark Knight uses the thingy and the other thingy, Warrior uses the thingy and expends the stack thingy, Paladin uses the thingy maybe uses the stoneskin thingy, and has a useless heal thingy that gets interrupted mostly.

Auxiliary functions of these tanks become; Warrior does dps - buffs tank(s) & Ninja damage - reduces raid wide damage taken, Dark Knight does dps - reduces magic damage taken (if you don't have a Monk) and reduces raid wide damage taken if it parries (force that main-tank role on ya), Paladin does less dps - reduces physical damage taken anddd it's extra mitigation is mostly hiding behind a shield (again force that main-tank role).

Why is that ^ an issue - Paladin and Dark Knight are always second fiddle (or at least need to be the one to be getting hit in the face) to Warrior when it comes to a raid. Always. Didn't bring a Warrior? Why? Go get a Warrior. Put your Warrior in the OT slot and enjoy having more damage, and more mitigation. Do it! Do it all the time - every time because DRK and PLD aren't good at off-tank roles because they need to get hit in the face for their shiny extras to work.

Hell even if Cover sucked less it'd need to also allow you to block Covered damage so you could use your other junk - like Shield Swipe since you don't have a TP factory in your butt...

Like Warrior.

And even then - DRK MT with a WAR OT would be better unless the content suddenly was pulling gimmicks like Bahamut's Ahk Morn dookie-dumper followed by Nael's back-scratch attack or whatever.


It's really a balance issue between WAR vs. PLD/DRK; WAR always gets a slot because it reduces both types of damage and increases it's own damage and the raid damage. Oh and it does the most damage too.


Wiggledy-diggledy-doo.