Lets nerf WAR :D

[OPneedNerfs]

That doesn't prove the WAR is "obscenely overpowered." Look, I will admit my bias, but that's what you're up against here. I'm not convinced that WAR needs to be nerfed, especially not through your proposed changes.



How do you know it was because of WAR, specifically? Did they say that? Sure, WAR was a contributing factor, but there were several others, as well (DRK allowing groups to drop MNK, pentameld/STR accessories, tanking in DPS stance, healer DPS, being particularly exceptional players, etc.). Correct me if I'm wrong.

Because PLD/DRK was impossible to clear in i190 just like the devs said? Heck, even PLD/WAR was having major issues that they switched to DRK/WAR for more DPS and that was from one of the top progression raiding teams now.

[PotatoWafflez]

Because PLD/DRK was impossible to clear in i190 just like the devs said? Heck, even PLD/WAR was having major issues that they switched to DRK/WAR for more DPS and that was from one of the top progression raiding teams now.

Isn't that just progression meta though? you switch out all the weak parts for better ones? I can't think a single progression raid that doesn't stack class advantages in any game. I really don't see how they even care half the time either because isn't their main goal just to down the fight before anyone else regardless of what class they play?

I feel like the problem is more that people expect to be able to play any class they want when the gear treadmill isn't at the point where that is viable but once you get to that point and past it all of this becomes moot as its not longer as big a issue because the checks got easier from having more gear.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong

[OPneedNerfs]

Isn't that just progression meta though? you switch out all the weak parts for better ones? I can't think a single progression raid that doesn't stack class advantages in any game. I really don't see how they even care half the time either because isn't their main goal just to down the fight before anyone else regardless of what class they play?

I feel like the problem is more that people expect to be able to play any class they want when the gear treadmill isn't at the point where that is viable but once you get to that point and past it all of this becomes moot as its not longer as big a issue because the checks got easier from having more gear.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong

Sigh... the gear argument again. When Job A is able to clear content WEEKS before Job B due to gear limitations which are gated by time and RNG, and when Job B is what the devs/the community views as the normal pace of progression, Job A is broken by that definition is it not?

And also, the biggest flaw of the gear argument is that while Job B now becomes able to complete said content, Job A gets a boost to their ability to clear the content much smoother/safer/faster. Gear helps all jobs, not just the ones that are lacking so it's a pretty moot point when it comes to balancing jobs.

[RapBreon]

Because PLD/DRK was impossible to clear in i190 just like the devs said? Heck, even PLD/WAR was having major issues that they switched to DRK/WAR for more DPS and that was from one of the top progression raiding teams now.

This happens in very difficult world firsts (class stacking, crazy one-heal strats; which only some healers can do, etc.). I'm not sure that's evidence of PLD being broken (non-optimal for the fight/tier yes). An extreme outlier, a trend does not make. I'm not sure why people keep pointing to a situation irrelevant for well over 99.9999% of the playerbase.

In the context of other MMOs, this game is...very well balanced.

[Duelle]

This happens in very difficult world firsts (class stacking, crazy one-heal strats; which only some healers can do, etc.). I'm not sure that's evidence of PLD being broken (non-optimal for the fight/tier yes). An extreme outlier, a trend does not make.

You mean like how the extreme outlier of Coil 4/5 somehow convincing people that WARs could not tank HM Garuda?

For lack of better terms, this shit rolls downhill. If it's done at the top, it'll trickle down eventually. That's how it works, and that's why balance and parity are so important.

[RapBreon]

You mean like how the extreme outlier of Coil 4/5 somehow convincing people that WARs could not tank HM Garuda?

For lack of better terms, this shit rolls downhill. If it's done at the top, it'll trickle down eventually. That's how it works, and that's why balance and parity are so important.

People being unable to interpret data is an issue that can't be solved (not game-wise, different topic). Even if all three tanks were perfectly balanced; one would still have to sit for the world first. Even if that other tank is capable of doing it (WARs could do 4/5, it was just simply harder; a burden world firsts wouldn't shoulder because it jeopardizes their chances). Balance is not necessarily that out-of-whack (not in the situation presented anyway); but it is certainly overblown.