8-man Dungeons?

[JayCommon]

Dungeons are totally different from raids. In raids you need to perform to perfection in order to pass and somehow it should take around 10min to pass. Dungeons are different. You don't need any prior knowledge to pass them and you can learn mechanics quite fast compared to raids.

Some people can learn raid mechanics faster than others can learn dungeon mechanics. Elysium/Lucrezia didn't need any prior knowledge to pass Alex Savages. Every single world first video has some kind of mistake or unintentional death that occurs, so runs weren't perfect. I fail to see where you are drawing these comparisons from, and how this is any different from a dungeon, using this analysis as basis for argument.

In FFXIV the only real things that differentiate a raid from a dungeon is: how hard you're being hit by damage, and how much damage you're expected to put out. We don't have winding paths or special objectives. We get dropped in front of a house-sized boss and are told to kill it for the majority of the floors/turns. Or we ride an elevator to the boss. Or we jump around to get to it. If you aren't mitigating/healing through damage well enough, or are not putting out as much damage as you should be, chances are you will fail. You can "not" mitigate anything in a dungeon and probably be fine as long as your healer doesn't afk. You can perform a subpar rotation and lose hundreds of DPS because of it, but that won't cause you to die in most dungeons.

And to Ayerinn: The only thing that matters is SE calls them Raids so that's what we have. You can subjectively disagree with the format/execution SE has adopted for its raiding content but to outright dismiss their content as "not raid" is ridiculous. I'm not sure which MMO has you jaded into believing raid content can only be done 1 certain way but here, SE chose the latter:

raid
Often used with mmorpgs. It involves players banding together to succeed at a common goal- such as taking over territory, killing an opposing faction, or most commonly killing big scary internet monsters that drop coveted items.

It can be used as a noun or verb, noun referring a specific event, and in verbage, the act of embarking on that event.
A: We've scheduled a Black Temple raid tonight. You coming?
B: I can't raid, I gotta get laid!
A: No epix or dkp for you!

Link for Source. Definiton #7 is pretty funny

[Colorful]

snip

How much did they wipe on A4S again, something like 400+ times? Sure they learn fast in comparison to others, but that's not "fast" by any means. Raids are very different from dungeons, in the case that Castrum and Praetorium don't have a set pattern and a continuous flow. In 24 man raids it's: circular (or square/rectangle) room with trash > boss > circular room with trash > boss > circular room with trash > boss > boss, with a little variety occasionally. In Alexander the fights aren't continous, you have to change instance after every boss. Castrum could be compared to the more traditional raids seen in WoW, that alone sets them apart by miles. In my honest opinion the CT and Alexander raids should be more similar to Castrum in the structure so they don't feel like the same thing with a different skin every few patches and actually have variety, but that's a subject for another day.

I'm all for more 8 man dungeons, disappointed that they didn't make the level 60 dungeon 8 man, especially when (spoilers)

King Thordan shows up and suddenly you have 4 more people fighting alongside you. That made no sense.

[JayCommon]

How much did they wipe on A4S again, something like 400+ times? Sure they learn fast in comparison to others, but that's not "fast" by any means...

Let's disregard the fact that you took two of my points and mashed them together as if they were supposed to be, and then applied them to one of the hardest fights of the game. Conversely, I saw the Resin Bomb drops during the Air Phase in A1S once, and knew exactly what the team needed to do to bait them without watching any videos prior, and what I told my team to do worked the very next time. Please don't make the "mechanics" of raid fights seem harder than they are. It's the "teamwork" involved in doing the mechanics that most groups struggle with. I honestly could care less if they wiped 4000 times; they beat the content without guides available because everyone else was waiting for them to make the guides.

I never said Elysium/Lucrezia were fast at clearing A4S. They were only brought up to prove that you don't need to watch a video before attempting to figure something out that is Raid content in FFXIV. If you don't want to or can't put in the time to do that, then that's perfectly fine. But don't claim that you "need prior knowledge to win" because that's just silly. No one would ever win if that was truly the case.

I am fully aware the major differences between raids and dungeons in this game. The person I quoted outlined them extremely poorly.

As an aside: your spoiler confused the crap out of me too. It's like, "Oh, where did y'all come from?" I do love that fight though...