WHM dps VS. SCH dps

[Raminax]

Shroud of Saints restores a static amount of MP, based on player level. (707 MP / 3 Seconds @ Level 60) (180 Second CD)
You have to time shroud correctly to get all 5 ticks, so in general most WHMs will restore 2828MP

I must be pretty amazing at timing Shroud, seeing as I've just haphazardly clicked it 20 times since I saw this message and always received 5 ticks of refresh. No more, no less.

Also, it's a 120 second cooldown. Seems someone needs to take their White Mage off of the trophy stand and polish it.

Otherwise, I'll admit Scholars are significantly more practical when it comes to doing damage, but assuming in a world of infinite MP and no accuracy requirements, I'd imagine White Mages would edge out over them. Alas, it's a cold and cruel universe, so we'll have to do with accuracy checks and MP issues for the moment.

[Rewind]

I must be pretty amazing at timing Shroud, seeing as I've just haphazardly clicked it 20 times since I saw this message and always received 5 ticks of refresh. No more, no less.

Also, it's a 120 second cooldown. Seems someone needs to take their White Mage off of the trophy stand and polish it.

Otherwise, I'll admit Scholars are significantly more practical when it comes to doing damage, but assuming in a world of infinite MP and no accuracy requirements, I'd imagine White Mages would edge out over them. Alas, it's a cold and cruel universe, so we'll have to do with accuracy checks and MP issues for the moment.

Sorry, I must have been a misread the CD as I was using a website to get the potency calculation, The 5th tick is legitimate in combat. Please see https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...nt_for_whm_in/

No need to be insulting ^_^

I also said ignore mana dependency, disregard all "setbacks" so to speak.

Then WHM wins both AoE and Single Target (infinite MP pool). Though that will never happen >.<

[Raminax]

Sorry, I must have been a misread the CD as I was using a website to get the potency calculation, The 5th tick is legitimate in combat. Please see https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...nt_for_whm_in/

No need to be insulting ^_^

Yerr, sorry for the snideness. I just assumed you were going on a drunken rampage. (Can't spell assumption without ass, I guess?)

That said, I'm testing both Shroud of Saints and Luminiferous Aether right now with various timings (just after a Regen tick, somewhere inbetween, just before a Regen tick and so on) and I keep getting a consistent 5 ticks of Refresh, even in combat. :/ Perhaps latency might affect it? We all know XIV has lots of silly shenanigans going on with its netcode to begin with, latency might just be making it worse losing random DoT/HoT/SoS ticks. Guess I'll have to test further inside some raid later on, because fighting individual enemies probably isn't straining things that much.

Either latency, or the timing isn't as strict as the post is claiming.

And it could've also just been fixed. Two months ago is quite a while, considering the amounts of hotfix patches we've had.

[mp-please]

Either latency, or the timing isn't as strict as the post is claiming.

Latency has nothing to do with server ticks, if you pop shroud/LA right before a server tick you'll only get 4 ticks instead of 5. But yea you really need to screw up badly to get 4 ticks instead of 5 but its always something to watch out for.

[MyaValentine]

Sorry, I must have been a misread the CD as I was using a website to get the potency calculation, The 5th tick is legitimate in combat. Please see https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...nt_for_whm_in/

No need to be insulting ^_^



Then WHM wins both AoE and Single Target (infinite MP pool). Though that will never happen >.<

Haha, no doubt

[Ghishlain]

Sorry, I must have been a misread the CD as I was using a website to get the potency calculation

To be fair about this statement - there's actually fairy large misconception that Shroud of Saints is 180s when in actuality it's only 120s. When I asked a few posters about this in a different thread they replied that it was listed at 180s on a variety of websites and I did what I could to edit that number on most wiki's (though there was one I couldn't access the edit button to, sadly). Therefore you aren't the first person to think Shrouds is 180s and certainly won't be the last - it's apparently a very common misconception. If I were to take a guess, I think Shroud was a 180s cooldown back in 1.0? That would be my one and only guess for this misinformation across a variety of sources.

I'm beginning to encourage most people to use Garland Tools Database for all their FFXV tooltips because s/he seems to keep the site regularly updated and accurate.

[Raminax]

Rawr.

I'll acknowledge it, but it does feel like a bit of an exaggeration to say that one will get '4 ticks in general'. Especially considering how hard I had to try to get 4 ticks (I did get one Luminiferous Aether disappointing me in the end). Had a try where my Shroud expired, but then I got the 707 MP tick a split second later, lol.

Rawr!

I did see 399 MP costs for Cure III pop up occasionally when it was quite clearly 505 back then. Perhaps I'm just a hopeless nerd who remembers these things.

Either way, burn ze databases with fire! And let them be reborn as a glorious phoenix!

[Rewind]

I'm beginning to encourage most people to use Garland Tools Database for all their FFXV tooltips because s/he seems to keep the site regularly updated and accurate.

Thanks! I'll be honest and say that I don't really consider how long my shroud CD is for fights, I use it rather at a particular % and every point after or at a time where I know I'll need to drop emnity fast. It's become so automatic I just never consider the site to be incorrect.

Just to identify the incorrect site http://www.ffxivinfo.com/class/conjurer.php // http://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/wiki/Conjurer

[Ghishlain]

For the sake of easy math, going to assume the following:

1. A universal GCD of 2.5s (24 GCDs per minute)
2. When a DoT is applied, they'll be given their full duration
3. Infinite MP
4. One Minute Time Frame
5. Training Dummy Target (no accuracy requirement)
6. Assumes you are reapplying DoTs in a manner that has absolutely no overlap (though that's near impossible at times)

=====================

SCH DPS
Bio
Total Duration 18 seconds for 240 Potency
Needs to be applied 4 times in a minute
960 Potency Total

Bio II
Total Duration 30 seconds for 350 Potency
Needs to be applied 2 times in a minute
700 Potency Total

Miasma
Total Duration of 24 Seconds for 300 Potency (Including Initial Damage)
Needs to be applied 3 times in a minute
900 Potency Total

Shadow Flare
Total Duration of 30 Seconds for 250 Potency
Needs to be applied 2 times in a minute
500 Potency Total

Aero
Total Duration 18 seconds for 200 Potency (Including Initial Damage)
Needs to be applied 4 times in a minute
800 Potency Total

SCH DoTs account for 15 GCDs in a minute

Broil
170 Potency Total for 9 GCDs
1,530 Potency Total

Energy Drain
150 Potency per Use - 3 Stacks / minute to be used with each application of an instant cast DoT
450 Potency Total

3,860 Potency Total DoTs / Minute
1,530 Potency in Broils / Minute
450 Potency in Energy Drain / Minute

SCH Potency Potential = 5,840 Potency / Minute

Add another 450 Potency if Aetherflow is readily available and SCH is beginning rotation with full stacks. Add another 450 Potency if Dissipation is used as a DPS tool.

Fey Wind does not provide an additional attack in this window.

=====================

WHM DPS
Aero
Total Duration 18 seconds for 200 Potency (Including Initial Damage)
Needs to be applied 3 times in a minute (to be used in conjunction with Fluid Aura and Assize for maximum effect)
600 Potency Total

Aero II
Total Duration 12 seconds for 250 Potency (Including Initial Damage)
Needs to be applied 5 times in a minute
1,250 Potency Total

Aero III
Total Duration of 24 Seconds for 370 Potency (Including Initial Damage)
Needs to be applied 3 times in a minute
1,110 Potency Total

WHM DoTs account for 11 GCDs in a minute

Stone III
210 Potency Total for 13 GCDs
2,730 Potency Total

Fluid Aura
150 Potency per Use - 2 uses / minute to be used with each application of Aero
300 Potency Total

Assize
300 Potency per Use - 1 use / minute to be used with each application of Aero
300 Potency Total

2,960 Potency Total DoTs / Minute
2,730 Potency in Stone III / Minute
300 Potency in Fluid Aura / Minute
300 Potency in Assize / Minute

WHM Potency Potential = 6,290 Potency / Minute

Add another 210 Potency if Presence of Mind is used to allow for an extra GCD within it's buff timer.

Due note that Assize is actually 300 potency / 90 seconds and a total of 600 potency / 3 minutes.

=====================

Above math doesn't account for the fact not all DoTs line up with a 60s timer so there will be some overlap when expanding this timer beyond one minute. Also the math is considering the full duration of the DoT when applied - so it'll do less damage when considered at the end of a minute. However, multiplying the above by however minutes one desires should allow for a decent approximation one can expect. Be sure to allow for buff / ability timers when doing said multiplication as some buffs will not be available on each minute.

Looking at above, and considering infinite MP, WHM wins the race by approximately 7.7% when factoring just sustained damage.

[Edit] Had to readjust specific values as you'll be applying some DoTs more often due to time of application

[MyaValentine]

For the sake of easy math, going to assume the following:

=====================

Above math doesn't account for the fact not all DoTs line up with a 60s timer so there will be some overlap when expanding this timer beyond one minute. Also the math is considering the full duration of the DoT when applied - so it'll do less damage when considered at the end of a minute. However, multiplying the above by however minutes one desires should allow for a decent approximation one can expect. Be sure to allow for buff / ability timers when doing said multiplication as some buffs will not be available on each minute.

Looking at above, and considering infinite MP, WHM wins the race by approximately 7.7% when factoring just sustained damage.

[Edit] Had to readjust specific values as you'll be applying some DoTs more often due to time of application

Thanks sir, appreciate the numbers.