How to Dragoon per Second: A DPS Paradigm

[whiskeybravo]

It's not terribly off, 35 det = 4.865 str per the stat weights.. But regardless.

Skill speed has more value at low levels and lower value at high levels. It's all situational. In my situation I wouldn't wear gordian boots until I could drop skill speed elsewhere, as far as I've been able to tell, running with different sets at 600, 640, and 690 numbers, there's not anything I can do at 697 I couldn't do at 647, and certainly nothing I need 747 to do. If you are talking about going from 550 to 600, or 600 to 650, then there are significant benefits that you can see.

And maybe that's the kicker. The negatives of higher skill speed are more noticeable than the benefits. It's easier to see that higher skill speed is disrupting double-weaving and nearly throwing BotD to after CT/FT instead of right before. Whereas, it's not incredibly obvious when you get an extra hit that you might not have gotten at lower levels.

[LiquidSwordz]

Using this gearset...http://ffxiv.ariyala.com/RQYP, wouldn't it be beneficial to drop the SS of the Gordian boots since its pretty excessive while gaining DET and more ACC needed for AS4?

[ReliaWylder]

I think this is the major point Relia was overlooking ...

IMO your skill speed would have to be extremely low to end with impulse drive rather than disembowel. You can also do your second jump before sluice puddles at 580 skill speed as well and not get hit.

And of course the 210 gordian boots are better than the 200 eso boots. The STR difference eclipses everything else. But the point I was trying to make was toward the initial question about sks vs det, all else equal.

[JackFross]

IMO your skill speed would have to be extremely low to end with impulse drive rather than disembowel. You can also do your second jump before sluice puddles at 580 skill speed as well and not get hit.

And of course the 210 gordian boots are better than the 200 eso boots. The STR difference eclipses everything else. But the point I was trying to make was toward the initial question about sks vs det, all else equal.

It all just probably feels a lot tighter than it is, then. I ran into an issue tonight with my 658 sks where I actually hit Disembowel so early that my combo died before I could get Chaos Thrust on the hand; happened twice, so that's an issue I chalk up to high sks more than anything else.

I recorded a few runs tonight to review where I was going wrong and sitting sub-1400 when I should be able to be over;;; I figured out that I seem to just... stop attacking for the second digititis pass, which is a HUGE loss I'm almost purposely taking. Not sure I'm doing anything else necessarily "wrong" but any pointers would be welcome, if you guys see anything else I'm blatantly missing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kANPLJF3YWI

And the deeps from that run through hand-adds transition was:
http://puu.sh/kCvvy/d21af4a542.jpg


I also happened to be recording when I wiped the raid because, tbh, that FaC positional is more important than the party living.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRgksBkB-to

[seekified]

It all just probably feels a lot tighter than it is, then. I ran into an issue tonight with my 658 sks where I actually hit Disembowel so early that my combo died before I could get Chaos Thrust on the hand; happened twice, so that's an issue I chalk up to high sks more than anything else.

I've run into that or something similar dozens of times as well, but I have less than 600 at the moment. I do probably have higher latency though, which might be what's actually happening for me - I know that as MCH, I regularly hit Clean Shot before the server has registered the proc, thus giving me a Clean Shot with castbar even though the proc shows up milliseconds later, which would've made it instant-cast. Really weird.

Similar stuff has happened on DRG where I'll break the IDC combo partway for no apparent reason, thus not giving me a 4th and thus dropping BotD. Funtimes. I'll do a lot of testing on this once Chaos is moved in a couple of weeks, I'm hoping it improves to the point where I don't have to worry about being faster than my procs.

[whiskeybravo]

I also happened to be recording when I wiped the raid because, tbh, that FaC positional is more important than the party living.

Yes.. Yes it is lmao

I did find something I could do at 697 that I didn't seem to be able to do at 640ish.. The last boss of neverreap always goes invulnerable right as the 2nd 4th hit comes up.. Not anymore xD

A3 stuff

I thought you did a few IDs going into the hand phase, then Dis-CT after? That's what I've been doing, haven't lost the combo. The second digi in our group is f'd kinda because we still doing fist > EC > fist.. So it's run to the edge, wait, run to center, (2nd digi), wait, run to edge.. Inefficient for sure.. And I find my self stopping about halfway, GK, check the debuffs, then run back in. We've been making it further more recently so while we can definitely improve overall dps it's not holding us up from transitioning, at least.

[JackFross]

I thought you did a few IDs going into the hand phase, then Dis-CT after? That's what I've been doing, haven't lost the combo. The second digi in our group is f'd kinda because we still doing fist > EC > fist.. So it's run to the edge, wait, run to center, (2nd digi), wait, run to edge.. Inefficient for sure.. And I find my self stopping about halfway, GK, check the debuffs, then run back in. We've been making it further more recently so while we can definitely improve overall dps it's not holding us up from transitioning, at least.

I had been doing HT>ID>ID>[ID] at the end of P1, but a few people pointed out that I get the extra GCD there so might as well make it a Disembowel. What I was also considering doing is going back to ID>ID>ID then after transition just doing Dis>CT>TTT4 without the Phleb there; would be the same amount of GCDs without that irritating delay on will I drop combo or will I not, and cutting Phleb from the rotation isn't a massive pps loss right there, I don't think.

The way my group does it, we don't even bait hand or fist. It's always just one or the other and we just... deal with it, more or less. If you see in that video, DRK holds his all the way at the edge, but WAR holds hers about halfway between mid and edge. It'll be hand OR fist and we just adjust to whichever. It doesn't really impact my dps very much, since I drop gsk after the second CT combo finishes on the split hands so meh? But we're also hitting ~71% after hands, which is pretty significantly far behind. So I'm putting a lot of effort into maximizing my dps to do everything I can to push that harder.

Also, I've had a few pulls where I've been using HQ X-Pots. I see no notable difference in P1 or P2 dps when using them. I'm usually 1500-1550 without potion, and with potion I do like 1520-1580 or so with one lucky run cresting 1600. Just almost feels like it's pointless.

[whiskeybravo]

I didn't watch it since I'm at work but will check it out later. I do find it a little odd that you were/are able to get 3 IDs before hand, even at 697 skill speed I HT>ID>[ID] then Dis once it's targetable again. Maybe you are attacking it a bit sooner than I am on the pull?

71% when he's human form again after the adds? Or you talking about when they merge to begin add phase? IIRC the few times we've made it past adds he was 65-68%. As for the xpots, it kinda makes sense but kinda doesn't.. Since 84 str is less % the more str you have.. Like at 1100 str its 7.6% but 1000 str is 8.4%. So it's just less impact at higher str maybe?

[JackFross]

That comment on the potion is what I'm thinking. 84 Strength just isn't all that much anymore. I feel one lucky run is just as helpful as a potion. The potions raise your average dps, sure, but when the range is so wide, that increase can't really be meaningful enough that it should be necessary to use them.

And talking 71% when the hands merge back together at the end of the phase. I've read you want 69% at most at that point, so my group is like way behind and I don't know how to really bump that up. Since we do around 29% damage, we'd need to boost it by 2%, which is like a 7% raid-wide dps increase to manage. Since we have like 6700 dps, that's an extra 450-470 dps we need to pump out. I can't do it alone, but if I could shave off 50-60 of that on my own... x_x

And it's either that you're slow on the pull or you don't have that beautiful lady known as Selene.

[Hakmatic]

I'll tell you how to bump it up, tell that monk to get good. Lol