How to Dragoon per Second: A DPS Paradigm

[Thendiel]

I've noticed that with this patch's dragoon change, it is possible to do a 4th geirskogul in 1 BOTD. Problem is, you delay your BOTD refresh by about 10 seconds, so it is about 4 geirskoguls per 70 seconds. Another thing I've noticed is that you can't do 2 geirskoguls + B4B if you did 4 geirskoguls per 70 seconds. Is it worth doing 4 geirskoguls? You only have about 1 second to do a 4th attack, and that's if you are always attacking the boss. I did this small test with 2.39 GCD, or 634 skillspeed.

Off the cuff, I think that landing extra Geirskoguls is the new meta now. Landing 4 Geirskoguls every 70 seconds (which I've previously described as 3.5 Geirskoguls per minute) gives us an extra 100 potency plus buffs every 60 seconds = 1.67 raw PPS. By contrast, landing an extra BFB-boosted Geirskogul every time we use BFB results in a bonus of 200 x 0.30 potency plus buffs every 80 seconds = 0.75 raw PPS. The extra GK output is significantly superior.

On top of this, I personally have found that using two Geirskoguls per Blood for Blood is extremely contextual, and can only be executed on occasion in a raid setting. Usually my Geirskogul choices have more to do with adds and phase transitions than they do with the dummy-based abstraction of 2-GKs-per-BFB. (The 3.5-GKs-per-minute thing is contextual, too, but I believe that it ought to be fairly feasible at certain points in every current endgame fight, maybe with the exception of A10S.)

In any case, I find that the timing of using 3.5 Geirskoguls per minute is pretty lenient and flexible in practice, especially at a Skill Speed of about 650. I'm enjoying the technique, and I'm subjectively finding that my dummy parses have improved a bit since I started using it. Furthermore, if things go south and I have to step away from my target, it's typically very easy to revert back to the usual approach of landing just 3 Geirskoguls per minute.

That said, shooting for 3.5 GKs per minute means that any unexpected downtime at about the 38-second mark of a Blood of the Dragon cycle (between your 3rd and 4th Geirskoguls) could cause you to lose BotD prematurely. Additionally, this approach completely rules out the use of a Strength Potion before Chaos Thrust in the opener, thus forcing us to employ a slightly weaker opener. Finally, I should mention that I'm a bit biased, since I've been theorizing about this idea since Heavensward launched, and suddenly--viola!--I wake up to find that it is extremely viable, even comfortable, with none of the TP consumption disadvantages I was anticipating.

Anyone have any thoughts? Criticisms? Modeling data?

P.S. - I'll be watching the thread for people's BiS recommendations and thoughts, and will update the main post if there is a consensus. I'm hoping that random Diadem gear doesn't wind up BiS again, but it probably will.

[Sentinillia]

things

stuff

Could you elaborate on this? How do I into 3.5 GKs? This is the first time I see it mentioned and I wouldn't know where to begin.

//EDIT: 2 minutes after posting I did indeed figure it out. Morning grogginess is evil.

[Aquaslash]

On top of this, I personally have found that using two Geirskoguls per Blood for Blood is extremely contextual, and can only be executed on occasion in a raid setting.

Anyone have any thoughts? Criticisms? Modeling data?

P.S. - I'll be watching the thread for people's BiS recommendations and thoughts, and will update the main post if there is a consensus. I'm hoping that random Diadem gear doesn't wind up BiS again, but it probably will.

I came to this very same conclusion in practice, and thought I was just bad. The times where BfB and BotD lined up for this seemed to be rare unless I specifically held off BfB just to do this. Wasn't sure if it was worth it and I was gonna look it up again

[Thendiel]

Right, sorry. We didn't really explain ourselves very well. Here is an old video of mine illustrating what the technique of landing 3.5 Geirskoguls per minute looks like. We just don't need nearly as much Skill Speed to do it anymore, thanks to Patch 3.5's changes to buff timing--specifically, since BotD gains time the moment we *click* Fang and Claw or Wheeling Thrust, rather than the moment the animation of those attacks completes.

[Remus]

So I currently have BiS for when I get my 275 raid weapon. I was wondering is there a BiS for full crit/det relic at 270?

[SunnyHirose]

Hm, I knew Geirskoguls were getting a funkier flow, but if I was getting 4 per activation it was by accident. It's rad!

But the reasons I never noticed, though, is because (bad news, everyone) I'm on break from raiding for a while. Want to raid SB, SB requirements are higher than my PC, can't afford to upgrade my PC without finances, can't get the finances without dropping raiding. Oh well. Not the ideal circumstances, but hopefully in the meantime I will finally put serious hours into writing that monograph I've been working on since 2.5.

So I currently have BiS for when I get my 275 raid weapon. I was wondering is there a BiS for full crit/det relic at 270?

You just swap it in if it's crit/det. But the accuracy relic BiS is slightly better right now, about 3 more DPS in simulation (yes, even losing 1 WD! No, I have not lost my mind here; WD values have never been this high and goon secondary itemization hasn't had to face a dilemma like the alexandrian/scripture pants before).

[Aquaslash]

You just swap it in if it's crit/det. But the accuracy relic BiS is slightly better right now, about 3 more DPS in simulation (yes, even losing 1 WD! No, I have not lost my mind here; WD values have never been this high and goon secondary itemization hasn't had to face a dilemma like the alexandrian/scripture pants before).

How did this happen? I'm truly curious because I see so much talk about WD being the end all be all of everything.

[aleph_null]

How did this happen? I'm truly curious because I see so much talk about WD being the end all be all of everything.

The scaling of dps with respect to crit is quadratic, so the more crit you have, the more valuable every additional point of crit is. This is the opposite of det/WD/str, since the scaling of dps with respect to det/WD/str is linear, they have diminishing returns.

[Aquaslash]

The scaling of dps with respect to crit is quadratic, so the more crit you have, the more valuable every additional point of crit is. This is the opposite of det/WD/str, since the scaling of dps with respect to det/WD/str is linear, they have diminishing returns.

Was there a certain threshold in crit that we passed to get to this point?

[CookieMonsta]

How did this happen? I'm truly curious because I see so much talk about WD being the end all be all of everything.

WD is still king but DRG has special circumstances with respect to gearing. The Sub stats are suboptimal on the 275 (Cap SKS) and the Shire pants are shit (we are forced to use it cuz acc). In this special scenario, by getting the relic to be cap crit and enough acc to cover the loss of the Shire pants, you can equip the extremely potent Alex pants thus the net result is a statweight gain over the BiS with the 275. So its not really because the 270 relic is more powerful per-se than the 275 but what it allows you to do.