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  1. #13
    Player
    Sibyll's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    438
    Character
    Sibyll Belmont
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 60
    Quote Originally Posted by LineageRazor View Post
    Compared against that, the crafting system in FFXIV is amazingly fun. You have real control over how things turn out. Admittedly, it's a system that favors mathematicians; leveraging probabilities to produce the best results over the long term is what crafting is all about. Some folks, though, just can't seem to wrap their head around the idea that just because a CAN go catastrophically wrong doesn't mean that it WILL. Murphy's Law is a big, fat lie. And, even if that odd failure crops up, you have plenty of successes to balance it out.
    I've had 20% Materia melds fail 30+ times before a success (yes it's happened on more than one occasion). I've failed 5 Hasty Touches with Steady Hand II in a row. I've also pentamelded using 6 materia total and gone an entire synth without failing a single Hasty/Rapid Synth. Troll the forums and you will find plenty of threads of similar stories, so if you've never experienced shit like this then more power to you for having the easiest time in the world crafting in FFXIV. Your last statement is fine if all you are doing is mass producing Wootz Ingots, but with 2* crafting you are kind of SoL if you get stellar RNG on the Ingots and Lumber but fail half of your Hasty Touches on the 2* Off hand you are trying to craft. This is where it falls short of 4* crafting. Unless you are using HQ aethersands (pure RNG time sink), you need about 9-10 IQ stacks to get 90+% meaning in a rotation where you can make 11 touch attempts you have minimal room for error. Compare this to 4* where full HQ starting mats on a final product would mean 6-7 IQ stacks would yield a 100%, but the trade off was that the ingots/lumber needed to be HQ'd from 0 initial quality. Your reward for mass producing base materials was a greater margin for error in the final product.


    Quote Originally Posted by LineageRazor View Post
    What was WoW crafting like? Just drop in the ingredients, and out comes a finished product? No HQ chance or failure risk?
    Yes, and to clarify this is mostly aimed at things like food/potions that you need lots of and need to be HQ. NQ Draconic potions are on par with HQ X-Potions (which come in stacks of 3). In WoW/Rift there is no HQing, so you can basically craft the food and potions for an entire raid with quick synth, something that would take hours of tedious crafting to do in FFXIV.

    Making potions and food in a game shouldn't feel like a chore.

    Quote Originally Posted by LineageRazor View Post
    Edit: Also, you mentioned this would never fly in Raid mechanics... except that they DO. Critical hits. Unless there's some limitation on how critical hits work in raids that I'm unaware of, every hit has a chance to crit and do extra damage. A crit or two here and there isn't likely to cause problems - but what if every hit is a crit? Not likely, of course, but it could theoretically happen. Hasty Touch is much the same way; a couple of Hasty Failures and you'll still be fine, but if all or most of them fail, you're screwed. It's the same deal.
    To my knowledge only auto attacks can crit. The difference is as a tank/healer I can look at why I died and think of things I could've done to prevent that: 1) healer could've kept me topped off, 2) I could put on more fending accessories, 3) I could time my CDs better during heavy AoE phases etc. When I fail a synthesis because I failed an 80% chance 5 times in a row what constructive thought process can the player go through? At best: 1) get more CP to get an extra touch attempts to "lessen" the effect of RNG, 2) Rethink your rotation. CP will only take you so far as it has a hard cap and unless a rotation exists that eliminates Hasty Touch completely this really isn't changing much.

    One last thing, RNG isn't bad by itself. The Good/Excellent conditions I think are fine RNG because it's something the player actively reacts to and I'd love to see more crafting mechanics where "something" happens and I need to choose how best to react to it. Success Rates are lazy RNG design and it's the equivalent of trying to DPS in a raid where you don't meet the accuracy cap. If Craftsmanship/Control raised success rate for associated skills I might actually treat these as useful stats instead of accuracy caps to reach and forget about.
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    Last edited by Sibyll; 09-15-2015 at 04:40 AM.