More Horizontal Progression please

[Nadirah]

Yet if everyone had gear choice like above there would be situations where one item is better in a situation yet all are viable.

No, there really wouldn't.

The way dps checks work is you'd find the mathematically best gear for that encounter and wear it, regardless of all else.

If you don't, you aren't beating it.

[Kaurie]

No, there really wouldn't.

The way dps checks work is you'd find the mathematically best gear for that encounter and wear it, regardless of all else.

If you don't, you aren't beating it.

That may be a problem more with the mechanics of a DPS check than with horizontal progression

[Nektulos-Tuor]

No, there really wouldn't.

The way dps checks work is you'd find the mathematically best gear for that encounter and wear it, regardless of all else.

If you don't, you aren't beating it.

We are not talking about very specific fights or the game. We are talking about Horizontal Progression in general.

Indeed, you do need enough dps to beat the encounter. However, what if the encounter also hit very hard. You need survivability as well and sustain. However, you need to also damage it fast enough to kill it.

If you and everyone go full DPS you will die to damage from the creature.
If you and everyone go full Healing and Sustain, you won't be able to do enough damage to the creature.
So, you need to form a raid of people who have both good damage, and good healing, using their play-styles. Which means some will have more healing based procs whilst others will have more damage based procs. Whilst some will like both, or mixing it up.

This means, every proc is viable.

Awnser.

If an effect or item has a huge advantage (over 30%) in a fight against every other item. Then it is no longer a choice, thus it immediately becomes vertical. Even if it started out horizontal. Vertical Progression means there is one best choice, and there are upgrades to that best choice.

Multiple ways of handling the same situation is true horizontal progression.

[Ibi]

If an effect or item has a huge advantage (over 30%) in a fight against every other item. Then it is no longer a choice, thus it immediately becomes vertical. Even if it started out horizontal. Vertical Progression means there is one best choice, and there are upgrades to that best choice.

Multiple ways of handling the same situation is true horizontal progression.

Got it. >30%: Vertical. <30%: Horizontal.

Thank you for providing your completely arbitrary line.

[Nektulos-Tuor]

Got it. >30%: Vertical. <30%: Horizontal.

Thank you for providing your completely arbitrary line.

If one item is 30% or better in a situation there is no need to use it over other items because there is such a huge difference in power. Sorry you disagree, but its the truth.

Thank you for arguing with me for no point or reason. I was trying to help you understand but it seems you just want to argue, for the sake of arguing.

[Ibi]

If one item is 30% or better in a situation there is no need to use it over other items because there is such a huge difference in power. Sorry you disagree, but its the truth.

At no point did I disagree with this. It's an obvious and factual statement.

I disagreed with that being the definition of vertical progression, because you have based your definition around a completely arbitrary cut off (>30% in any single situation in the entire game).

Thank you for arguing with me for no point or reason. I was trying to help you understand but it seems you just want to argue, for the sake of arguing.

I'm debating your definition because there's no point going "SE, we might want more horizontal progression" if we can't even agree on what horizontal progression is.

The vast majority of the people in this discussion seem to have much the same concept of horizontal progression, and were discussing the relative pros and cons of it, until you came into the discussion and went "No, you're all wrong, here's what I say horizontal progression is."