More Horizontal Progression please

[MilesSaintboroguh]

ugh, reminds me too much of Borderlands where you could have 5 of the same gun each with slightly different stats and effects. Think I wasted more time weighing my options and throwing away guns than actually playing.

[Kiara]

Hi All,

While there are pros and cons to both Vertical and Horizontal Progression systems, too many people always think it's "either / or"; there can be a *Hybrid* approach as well that alleviates a lot of the issues that both sides are concerned about.

The issues with the current Vertical Progression model (seen in XIV 2.0 and 3.0) is the constant overwriting of all your gear: Every 5 - 6 months = New Item Level Increase = All your Previous Gear is Worthless (except for glamour).

In addition, you get BORING as hell Stats on the gear: Final Fantasy XIV is the most Boring Itemization I've ever seen in an MMORPG or RPG, period. Every new gear patch, you already know what the Gear Stats will be:

* More + VIT
* More + [Main Stat]

BORING and so mindless.

Guess what your Item Level 900 Gear is going to be? "Surprise!" More +VIT, More + [Main Stat].

For those harping on Horizontal Progression and thinking "you'll be stuck with the same raid for 7 years!" Please think beyond the extreme:

* Yoshi P should consider a Hybrid Progression System, where instead of every single major patch being a pure Item Level increase, they should release New Raids with the *same* Item Level but with *meaningful* Additional Stats and Unique Effects, so we could have a few more Gear Sets without an iLevel increase.

You would still get the *same* number of New Dungeons and New Items as we do now, but it's not being invalidated every major patch. For example:

Instead of Current Style (example):

* Patch 4.0 - iLevel 300
* Patch 4.2 - iLevel 320
* Patch 4.4 - iLevel 340
* Patch 4.6 - iLevel 360

A Hybrid System would get:

* Patch 4.0 - iLevel 300 - Raid A
* Patch 4.2 - iLevel 300 - Raid B, NEW Alternate Gear Sets (Other Stats / Effects)
* Patch 4.4 - iLevel 320 - Raid C
* Patch 4.6 - iLevel 320 - Raid D, NEW Alternate Gear Sets (Other Stats / Effects)


Alternate Gear Set Ideas (quick examples):

Example Tank Sets (All Same Item Level) but with Meaningful Stats (that mattered)

* High Defense / VIT Set
* High Attack & Low Defense Set
* High Block / Parry Set (if Block and Parry were really scaling right)
* +X% Counterattack Set (or pieces that had "+ Counterattack")
* "Enhances Rampart" ("Enhances [XYZ] Ability / Spell" etc.)

There are so many interesting stats and Materia ideas that can be used from previous Final Fantasy games.

* Create End Game Crafted Gear Sets (same iLevel as highest Raid), but it requires a Rare Material Drop from the End Game Raids.

Your older Final Fantasy game did this very well (there were Abjurations that dropped in End Game Raids / Bosses and you used those along with rare Mats to have a Crafter create CURSED GEAR that you could UNCURSE).

It also made End Game Raids more enjoyable, because besides an actual Armor / Weapon dropping you might get a Rare Material (very valuable and meaningful) instead and it made the run still worth it. This connected Adventurers & Crafters in a great way.


They could even potentially have some Rare Materials (or maybe Rare Materia) drop as a New Item from OLDER Boss Chests, so that players would have a reason to go back to previous Raids and try those out.

Ultimately, though, a Hybrid approach would help slow down Item Level / Stat Inflation (something WOW has suffered from (where the numbers got so high / ridiculous they had to crunch / scale them down, almost like a reset)).

It would also help make your Gear / efforts feel like they mattered more: Instead of being reset every 5 - 6 months, your gear from Patch 4.0, Raid A (i300) would still be relevant and useful even during the next patch 4.2, which had Raid B (i300 Alternate Gear Sets).

This would also open up the door for More Interesting Stats and Effects on Gear. There should be *excitement* and interest in wondering what the New Gear in each Patch would be like (not appearance only).

You would wonder if it might have an "Enhance [Weaponskill / Spell]" Effect. Or maybe "Double Attack +X%". Or maybe "Counterattack +X%". Or had + Enmity, or + Evasion, etc.

Current Gear Itemization and End Game Raiding is completely Boring and is the same Treadmill every patch.

Lastly, know that I (and all the people who are asking for these updates) are only hoping that FF XIV improves and succeeds in the long run.

Thanks!

[FoxyAreku]

I am so happy that they don't do this. There's not even enough secondary stats for this to be a thing honestly.

Why would I want to re-fight something I've already beaten a million times at level 50? Unless there's some revenge plotline for ONE of them I don't want to see it.

[Tyla_Esmeraude]

I am so happy that they don't do this. There's not even enough secondary stats for this to be a thing honestly.

Why would I want to re-fight something I've already beaten a million times at level 50? Unless there's some revenge plotline for ONE of them I don't want to see it.

Orly? Is that why we have the same dungeons we have beaten a million times at lvl 60 now? Or how about that Alex normal, or that Ravana ex? Beaten them a million times already, too. Too bad SE can't release content fast enough once we've beaten them a million times, eh? Yeah, it's such a good idea replacing content that took them precious time to make after 3 months, the Devs will never have some cushion to fall on and die from overexhaustion. >.> (and before someone comes in and tries to counter argument with "well i dont want 7 years doing the same content", obviously it doesn't have to go THAT far, if you are that nitpicky. But in all honesty, this is one of the reasons 11 lasted so long, people never ran out of stuff to do.)

[StouterTaru]

There's not even enough secondary stats for this to be a thing honestly.

You misunderstand what horizontal progression in FFXI was. Your choices weren't VIT+INT+minor stats vs VIT+INT+other minor stats. It was HP+INT vs cast speed vs magic damage vs MP. When new content was introduced you didn't replace everything, you just had a few pieces that you needed for a job, maybe a couple more if you hadn't got all the previous gear.

Instead of content lasting 3-6 months then being obsolete, it lasted a few years. You had a much larger variety of end game content.