More Horizontal Progression please

[midnitdragoon]

You forget that EQ and FFXI also had the problem of *having* to put that many hours in it or you couldn't get anywhere or do anything.

I once dated a guy that played EQ1 in high school.

Court *took his computer away* because he refused to go to school, because otherwise he'd fall behind from his raid group.

You *had* to spend those long hours.

People don't have time for that and when they have a feeling of "well shit, I'm not getting anything done", the quit.

Thats really hardcore, prolly the reason why they put that message before you play ff11 each time you start up.

[Evtrai]

Thats really hardcore, prolly the reason why they put that message before you play ff11 each time you start up.

Lol not really, it depends on each individual person when they let something become an addiction, when I played FFXI I only played on weekends because that's the only time my parents allowed me to play games, but yeah, just because I enjoy drinking a beer on a ocasion doesn't mean I'm gonna turn into a raging alcoholic.

[lawlHT]

This game could definitely use some variation in its gear, through introducing more stats or amplifying job abilities through gear, and it would do a lot to make each piece of gear feel unique.

But a lot of people in this topic have some serious rosy tint to their glasses when they talk about ffxi. That game was just as much of a grind fest as this one, with the added bonus of sometimes going literal years without seeing certain drops. I'm much happier with this games loot system than I ever was with xi's

[Zumi]

This game could definitely use some variation in its gear, through introducing more stats or amplifying job abilities through gear, and it would do a lot to make each piece of gear feel unique.

But a lot of people in this topic have some serious rosy tint to their glasses when they talk about ffxi. That game was just as much of a grind fest as this one, with the added bonus of sometimes going literal years without seeing certain drops. I'm much happier with this games loot system than I ever was with xi's

One of the things that people forget about in FFXI was camping HNM. King Behemoth, Nidhogg, and Aspi dropped some of the best items in the game. On average they would only spawn once a week and sometimes would have upwards of 10 or more groups camping them. None of these HNMs were hard at all but getting the claim against everyone else in the zone was. So yes you had 1 chance a week and most of the time you didn't get to fight the boss because your group didn't win the claim.

This is why FFXIV system of instances is much better because everyone gets to fight the bosses and gets loot.

[Nektulos-Tuor]

One of the things that people forget about in FFXI was camping HNM. King Behemoth, Nidhogg, and Aspi dropped some of the best items in the game. On average they would only spawn once a week and sometimes would have upwards of 10 or more groups camping them. None of these HNMs were hard at all but getting the claim against everyone else in the zone was. So yes you had 1 chance a week and most of the time you didn't get to fight the boss because your group didn't win the claim.

This is why FFXIV system of instances is much better because everyone gets to fight the bosses and gets loot.

That is also why its boring because everyone gets everything. EQ2 fixed the issue by putting those bosses into large Open World Dungeons that took awhile to get to the bosses and if you just stood there the npcs would eventually overwhelm you.

So you had to get lucky and catch the bosses up, camping them was .. doable but you had a time limit before the room's enemy npcs over-ran you. Each NPC had their own unique skills/abilities they ran though and "strats" to kill them. With pathing/querky grouped mobs which had unusual social aggro.

Honestly. If they had a week spawn then they should be next to impossible to kill. Like harder then A4 Savage. Those were Avatars, most raids even the best could not kill them and there were 7 and they spawned, and despawned if you did not kill them fast enough. Completely random spawn timers too.

[lawlHT]

snip.

None of that reflects anything remotely resembling player-friendly content. Random spawn timers mean that if you're not playing 24/7 there's a good chance you're going to miss the monster even spawning, let alone seeing any drops from it. Instanced content alleviated a lot of the down time spent doing absolutely nothing in game, and gives players the ability to tackle content at their own pace, whenever they're able to play. Yes we have to sacrifice some of the feeling that came with open world content, but it was a necessary step to make sure that players didn't have to abandon their real lives in order to progress in the game

[Nektulos-Tuor]

None of that reflects anything remotely resembling player-friendly content. Random spawn timers mean that if you're not playing 24/7 there's a good chance you're going to miss the monster even spawning, let alone seeing any drops from it. Instanced content alleviated a lot of the down time spent doing absolutely nothing in game, and gives players the ability to tackle content at their own pace, whenever they're able to play. Yes we have to sacrifice some of the feeling that came with open world content, but it was a necessary step to make sure that players didn't have to abandon their real lives in order to progress in the game

Why does content have to be friendly? If its too easy its done way too quickly. The content should be hard and rewarding so it feels like you have to slow down and appreciate the rooms and work they put into the dungeons. In EQ2 most raids could not pass the first 2 bosses of zones, but they were meant to be more casual and easier then the rest. However it made people feel like they were progressing in the zones because they got enough good gear and got better and then started to take on harder bosses. They just didn't sit in one boss and "DIE" to it over/over/over.

It rewarded you when you succeeded, and when you failed it didn't reward you at all.

In this game, if you fail you get rewarded, if you succeed you get minor rewards that will be outdated in a month. GG.

[lawlHT]

There's an enormous difference between content being difficult and content being inaccessible because you don't spend every waking minute in front of a computer screen. There's no skill involved in waiting for a random spawn to occur, just an enormous amount of free time sunk into doing absolutely nothing at all

[Nektulos-Tuor]

There's an enormous difference between content being difficult and content being inaccessible because you don't spend every waking minute in front of a computer screen. There's no skill involved in waiting for a random spawn to occur, just an enormous amount of free time sunk into doing absolutely nothing at all

Uhm. Mistmoore Castle was a very harsh dungeon. However to get to a named mob it only took 20 minutes and the respawn times in the zone were 10-30 minutes. With placeholders and there were many nameds. All of them dropped good loot. Just an example, some were BiS for Legendary. It wasn't time-consuming, just hard. If your group failed or wiped you had to start all over again, so you had to be careful.

Your "Instances" are nothing more then a sham, sure it makes sure everyone gets loot. However, now your dungeons have no meaning and do not last. They are always going to be the same and lack a great deal of thrill and excitement. You don't even care about people your in the zone with because of duty finder and your in a group of strangers.

In Open World dungeons, you are not strangers. You are friends and the other players are rivals, you are watching every single thing other players are doing and because there are other players fighting you feel more immersed into the world.

Instances, are the worst thing to happen to MMOs. Might as well call it a Multiplayer Online game, its not massive anymore.

Of course, there were instanced dungeons too. However they didn't reward the set pieces you needed. Chestplate and Leggings were Open World only with helmet being in the hardest dungeon at the time: Unrest, a dungeon that took almost an hour and a half to finish.

I miss adventures with friends and the challenge of fighting my way down a dungeon and fighting nameds with unique skills, having to deal with them KNOWING IN 10 MINUTES the room will be full of baddies again! If we have to fight both we wipe, if we run we wipe...

It felt real to me.. because honestly. Your in a dungeon and your killing monsters but EVERYTHING happens the same way, in an almost comical way it seems uncannon to me. Your going to face a dragon general and he only throws a handful of minions at you... what about the ones flying above? Why are they not helping?

I haven't made a single friend in dungeons since I've played, nore do I remember their faces or names. I don't know a single person because quests are all solo quests and don't require help. I don't know anyone in the game besides who got me into the game and people I roleplay with.

In EQ, that was different.. I knew everyone and remembered their faces and names. I remembered their patterns. I "KNEW" them.

FFXIV, is the most anti-social MMO game I have ever played. That is a real honest statement.

Honestly however.. it was Mistmoore freaking Castle, a castle FULL of vampires.. you think it should be easy to just waltz in there uninvited?

[Nadirah]

FFXIV, is the most anti-social MMO game I have ever played. That is a real honest statement.

You must not have ever played WoW then.

And yes, FFXIV *does* feel very asocial, but not for the reasons you've given. I've elaborated on that in other threads, and this is not the place for that discussion.

I'd also suggest going back to EQ, but if I remember right there's a reason you're not there. You have a reputation.