What if Tank classes could only meatshield?

[Walluh]

What about not changing the current system, since it's actually enjoyable for a lot of tanks?

I really don't understand the problem with stancedancing, or why it ruins the 'feel' of being a tank. Do people just think heavily armored fighters never go on the offensive or something?

If anything, FFXIV's tanks are closer to the actual namesake - not only does it have the armored bit down, but now it has that lovely cannon as well.

[Shyle]

Know what would happen? A mass exodus of tanks in the game. They'd all roll DPS or possibly healer, or just straight up quit the game. In my opinion, the reason why we see tank dmg (DRK and War in particular) increasing is the same reason why Tank damage increased in WoW (a prime inspiration for FFXIV) and other MMO's, Doing damage is "fun". Granted, it's not the main job of the tank to focus "solely" on damage, but knowing you're contributing actual damage while being a tank makes the role more fun more *most* players (there are those weirdos (j/k) that don't care about dmg). I think people are still stuck in the early to mid 2000's when tanks were low damage meatshields. Times have changed since 2004/2005, tank classes were always hard to fill in groups, increasing dps/dmg helped alleviate that.

Now, as for the str v vit thing. Until SE gives encounters that actually *REQUIRE* full vit, you're going to see more str based tanks. It's quite possible that this is the design all along (with vit stacking for the "progression" encounters like savage).

[Yorumi]

Know what would happen? A mass exodus of tanks in the game. They'd all roll DPS or possibly healer, or just straight up quit the game. In my opinion, the reason why we see tank dmg (DRK and War in particular) increasing is the same reason why Tank damage increased in WoW (a prime inspiration for FFXIV) and other MMO's, Doing damage is "fun". Granted, it's not the main job of the tank to focus "solely" on damage, but knowing you're contributing actual damage while being a tank makes the role more fun more *most* players (there are those weirdos (j/k) that don't care about dmg). I think people are still stuck in the early to mid 2000's when tanks were low damage meatshields. Times have changed since 2004/2005, tank classes were always hard to fill in groups, increasing dps/dmg helped alleviate that.

I have to say I find it interesting that "tanks" would rather have a boring rotation but see damage numbers, over an interesting rotation based on keeping mitigation up and fights that are designed to challenge a tank's skill in reducing damage. Btw if anyone is stuck in the early 2000's it's the "I only want to be a dps" tank players. In EQ the way warriors held hate just damage and weapon procs. I suppose it's also funny that the main reason I quit tanking in this game is because it's so boring and you're not actually tanking. The dps in this game at least slightly more interesting rotations and if you're going to just be another dps, might as well be the best at it.

[Shyle]

snip.

Rotating CD's and mitigation skills are definitely still in the game. I know stance dancing makes things interesting and challenging, when to use the CD"s at the right time, etc. The rotation for warrior at least is more engaging than the DPS roles I've played to 60 so far since I have to not only do damage rotations, but use mitigation CD's and Self heals at the right moment, all while stance dancing (or at least as close as I can get to Stance dancing). Now, I can't say it's the same for Plds or even DRK, but warriors can have pretty interesting gameplay challenges.

[Duelle]

The rotation for warrior at least is more engaging than the DPS roles I've played to 60 so far since I have to not only do damage rotations, but use mitigation CD's and Self heals at the right moment, all while stance dancing (or at least as close as I can get to Stance dancing). Now, I can't say it's the same for Plds or even DRK, but warriors can have pretty interesting gameplay challenges.

You really should use more objective words to describe WAR gameplay. You call it interesting, I call it "too many buttons to push". Partly why I'm not fond of how WAR plays and prefer PLD. *shrug*

Though if you want to look at it a certain way, the reason WAR's gameplay feels more enganging to you is most likely because keeping Storm's Path up along with Maim and managing Wrath stacks feels more direct (in terms of benefits and what it does for you as a whole) and not "complex for the sake of complexity", which is something you see in DPS jobs at 60. Also helps that you don't have positional requirements to worry about.

[Yorumi]

Rotating CD's and mitigation skills are definitely still in the game. I know stance dancing makes things interesting and challenging, when to use the CD"s at the right time, etc. The rotation for warrior at least is more engaging than the DPS roles I've played to 60 so far since I have to not only do damage rotations, but use mitigation CD's and Self heals at the right moment, all while stance dancing (or at least as close as I can get to Stance dancing). Now, I can't say it's the same for Plds or even DRK, but warriors can have pretty interesting gameplay challenges.

And I made my comments from playing the tanks. War rotates through 3 combos without thought and hits typically the same skill every time they get 5 stacks. You don't have to manage stacks, consider the timing of a recast, adjust the rotation based on procs or the availability of certain resources or even really care about what damage type is incoming. Granted no class is particularly interesting and engaging but tanks really don't have much to think about. Heck most of the time the tank doesn't even need to be concerned with the fight mechanics, they just sit there beating on it. I think it's most indicative of a design flaw that so many are saying they don't care one bit about tanking and just want to dps on their tank.

[Sleigh]

There'd have to be another angle to it. It could not be pure aggro, as pretty much everyone else has mentioned that'd be extremely boring even if it was harder to do somehow, because the game wouldn't reward you as it does a good tank now (faster fight clears/DPS checks met easier/allowing you to meet enrages undergeared). There'd have to be some survival edge to even consider something like that, something like all your aggro has permanent Bloodbath attached to it, or your debuffs on the enemy are based on stats or something ... I don't know, hard to see how it would work, or why a dev would even go that route when everyone's DPS crazy these days.

It'd also complicate solo play tremendously.