Parsers and Problems

[Dante_V]

Instead of parsers have some new class quests with tight DPS checks.
- some dummy fight
- DPS while dodging AoEs and/or do other mechanics
- AoE DPS

As reward have new titles and glamor.

This doesn't help at all.

[HulveinBlitz]

When fights are mainly locked behind meeting a DPS check, especially in early phases, there has to be SOMETHING, SOMEWHERE, to check DPS/learn a proper rotation. No one will tell you, "doing high on a dummy, is the same as in an actual encounter". However, it will give you the foundation to go forward and attempt to pull similar numbers in an encounter.

If you think adding a parser will add more abuse.. its too late. The abuse arrived ages ago, and will continue regardless of a parser being implemented, or not.

[randysquirrel]

Parsers already exist, we can already see who is not pulling their weight, and who is terrible anyway, we are just all expected to pretend we don't. My group doesn't pug stuff much, but when we do, we can already see if the pug people are up to scratch. Do we kick them if not? No, because does it really matter, we can usually soldier on through anyway. Do we have a laugh about it in TS? Yes.


Real issue is that different parsers give slightly different results, so one universal in-game parser, would be preferable. Also its annoying that only PC-players have access to the current tool, and I have to constantly ask what my numbers were.

in my experience, the one only people who genuinely moan about other peoples dps, aren't that great themselves. No-one seems to have considered that an in-game parser would shut those folk up once and for all, they'd no longer be able to pass the blame onto anyone else, when we can all see their numbers as well. I think a parser might actually REDUCE the amount of b*tching (as I think most do it just to divert attention away from themselves)

also need an in-game parser so I can see if my numbers than my group's mnk, we're always quite close (me on blm), if he starts edging ahead of me i'll know I have to up my game hehe

[Fendred]

They wouldn't need parsers if they just made the damage based around a burst model instead of a sustained rotation model. FFXI didn't need parsers because the group either pulled off the skill chain or they didn't. It was visibly obvious when something was wrong. There are other ways to set up burst DD systems other than interweaving skill chains between players, and in all cases it becomes visibly obvious when someone is failing at their job. Combined with item level, that should be more than enough to invalidate most reasons for introducing a parser.

Plus, most people playing the game will not know how to properly interpret the results of a parser even if they had one. Designing the combat so they are not needed is the better solution.

[Odett]

Designing the combat so they are not needed is the better solution.

Yeah, overhauling a 2-year-old game's combat system is obviously the better solution compared to giving everyone a tool to measure DPS.

I did A1S yesterday with most people from my static and 3 PF DPS. We kept dying to Faust at 12% consistently. We had no way of knowing who was underperforming/how to improve group DPS because we had no way of measuring DPS, so instead we had to call it quits. A parser would have helped with this.

[Zeonx]

snip

Help like how kick people? They paid their subscription and is allowed to fight that fight, he got into the fight because the requirements were met.

You have to understand even if your DPS is greater that doesn't mean your dodging skills or healing skills or mechanics of the fight are going correctly so even if you were to kick the lowest person with the DPS you are not going to win.

Plus it almost sounds like you want to try and get someone with better attack damage to win you the fight and does all the work for your team you kick till that is accomplished then never return to the fight cause well if you went through all that work to win something's a problem. It aint the dps.

[sirDarts]

Help like how kick people? They paid their subscription and is allowed to fight that fight, he got into the fight because the requirements were met.

You have to understand even if your DPS is greater that doesn't mean your dodging skills or healing skills or mechanics of the fight are going correctly so even if you were to kick the lowest person with the DPS you are not going to win.

Plus it almost sounds like you want to try and get someone with better attack damage to win you the fight and does all the work for your team you kick till that is accomplished then never return to the fight cause well if you went through all that work to win something's a problem. It aint the dps.

If his abysmally low DPS means the content is not getting cleared, then he is wasting the time, and thus interfering with the enjoyment, of 3 or 7 other players. Those players are also paying a subscription... 3 > 1, 7 > 1... So yeah...

And when the content is getting cleared? NOBODY GIVES A DAMN about low DPS then! And those who do are just idiots and would be the same no matter if they have a parser or not.

[Zeonx]

If his abysmally low DPS means the content is not getting cleared, then he is wasting the time, and thus interfering with the enjoyment of 3 or 7 other players. Those players are also paying a subscription... 3 > 1, 7 > 1... So yeah...

And when the content is getting cleared? NOBODY GIVES A DAMN about low DPS then! And those who do are just idiots and would be the same no matter if they have a parser or not.

As like the forums, nobody is going to agree with a parser because it causes problems in the community and SE doesn't want problems in the game and then that goes back to the forums with more complaints.

Cause I don't agree with the parsering I see the attitudes of people who use them, its a video game people need to stop cussing and judging people how they play the game and calling them stupid and other crap because they can't beat a virtual monster.

That isn't anyones right to do, you are saying its justified you are wrong.

People have to dodge aoe's also do you guys also count that some just cant attack, blm's casting gets messed up or dps have to move out of way or there is a stack of aoe dmg on ground they cant get around or one person dies and is weakened so they die easy to dmg.

as I said parser's should not be allowed in game. gives people poor judgement over others causes problems.

[Odett]

Help like how kick people? They paid their subscription and is allowed to fight that fight, he got into the fight because the requirements were met.

You have to understand even if your DPS is greater that doesn't mean your dodging skills or healing skills or mechanics of the fight are going correctly so even if you were to kick the lowest person with the DPS you are not going to win.

Plus it almost sounds like you want to try and get someone with better attack damage to win you the fight and does all the work for your team you kick till that is accomplished then never return to the fight cause well if you went through all that work to win something's a problem. It aint the dps.

Ok, let's get started...

"Help like how kick people? They paid their subscription and is allowed to fight that fight, he got into the fight because the requirements were met."

Paying for your subscription only allows you to log into the game when it is up. H.ave you even entered Alex Savage? There is no set iLv requirement.

"You have to understand even if your DPS is greater that doesn't mean your dodging skills or healing skills or mechanics of the fight are going correctly so even if you were to kick the lowest person with the DPS you are not going to win."

Faust is a target dummy fight. There is no dodging. Healing skills don't matter if Faust enrages. He has to be killed before he enrages. Hence the term "DPS race".

"Plus it almost sounds like you want to try and get someone with better attack damage to win you the fight and does all the work for your team you kick till that is accomplished then never return to the fight cause well if you went through all that work to win something's a problem. It aint the dps."

...what? That was a bit hard to understand, but to answer your question, having a parser would allow us to see where everyone stands DPS-wise. This would let us know if we need to get better gear, or if someone is underperforming, find out why and see how we can improve our group DPS instead of asking "what went wrong?". By now I can tell that you haven't done any raid content when it is viable because one dps cannot carry a group. My static is not at the level of carrying other players. We need everyone to put forth a good amount of effort so we can clear these fights. We have no space for someone wanting to get carried.

[Sapphic]

Help like how kick people? They paid their subscription and is allowed to fight that fight, he got into the fight because the requirements were met.

So you would be perfectly fine in hard content if the tank couldn't or didn't evern try to hold enmity and the mobs where running all over the place killing everyone else? Or a healer that refuses to heal in hard content?

No you wouldn't. No one would. You would tell them and if no change, replace them. But that would be blatently obvious. Yet when It comes to DPS there isn't on all jobs obvious things to see if they are underperforming at the level neeeded to clear content. Parsers will show that. Or, more often than not, they think they are doing fine when they aren't. Parsers will show them the reality of why they cannot progress on content.

Wouldn't you prefer to know why you can't do certain content? Instead of continuing oblivious to the facts of why you cannot progress.

Tanks are accountable for mistakes or playing badly, healers are held accountable for mistakes and playing badly because it is painfully obvious when they do.

When I play tank and I screw up, bad things happen and it's obvious. When I run as SCH and I mess up, players die. Yet as MNK if I messed up my rotation, as i'm with other DPS, then it is not obvious.

Now give me a reason why DPS cannot be held to the same accountability as tanks and healers.