The Real Problem with Parsers

[Lyrica_Ashtine]

No no no, that's incorrect. If you have a parser you could literally be Mr. Rogers and the nicest guy or gal in the world but the second you turn it on you turn into The Incredible Hulk and just start breaking faces. Everyone knows this.

You can't blame the tool for a player's behaviour. That's on the same level as blaming a bicycle while cyclists are ignoring traffic rules.

I haven't bothered reading through 38 pages worth of yes-no-yes-no arguments, so I'll drop my 2 cents here: Stop looking at a possible witch hunt that may or may not be initiated by a selective group of people - Hooligans among football fans or literal medieval witch hunting. A parser tool could be useful for those who want to improve their damage output and get out of the so called "scrub zone". If such tools did not exist, no one would have created these "optimal DPS rotation guides" that's all over the place. Prime example being the dragoon topic here. Sure, you can create a rotation based on just theory, but this would create questions as why the rotation in question is "the best" and people start pulling out their spreadsheet programs based on average numbers they put out they see on screen. You could say they're manually "parsing". Such tools would just make it easier and help those improve for those who want to improve. Not only that, if said tools are presented on a silver platter, it may even motivate players to improve more. It takes far less effort and time than using spreadsheets, after all. For those who do not want to improve should not be surprised if they can't beat current- or last patch content till gear makes it completely obsolete. Nor should they be surprised if they get kicked out from parties for being the main cause for failing DPS checks for certain encounters. Which can be argued with what the OP started with what can be roughly translated into "I play like how I want to play". Such comments are double edged. If you choose how you want to play, then the same applies to others and who they decide to play with.

[RapBreon]

An easy way I've found for saying 'dont do this' is to just say what the problem is and making sure everyone is aware of it:

"We can't have the death zone on the healers, so please everyone watch out for that when it goes out"

Or something like that.

I suppose. The people I've spent lots of my time playing vidya with over the years; typically don't appreciate it just as much. Being said, they'd bitch about anything, so that might be the problem.

[KeluBehemoth]

Got a pretty good point.

There's virtually NO need for parsers outside of end game raids. Putting it in your average 24 man or Daily roulette PUG is just harmful.

I do wish they would allow you to talk about parsers though because if you really are intent on clearing something in PF and somebody just isn't cutting it you could atleast give them pointers.

Like today in a Shiva pony farm a guy was just casually saying the BLM was doing 300 DPS. We were clearing fine. I was leader. Didn't kick. First off his parser was probably inaccurate because we were killing very fast and second. It doesn't matter.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

Maybe you're right, but can you argue that they would be a very useful tool for many to improve? I mean, at its most basic, you have players who perform well and know how/why they perform well, players who don't and don't know how/why, and players who simply don't care. . . 2 of those categories would remain largely unaffected by parser implementation. But those stuck in that very grey area in the middle - not knowing how or why they don't do well - would benefit GREATLY.

Thing is, you can give anyone all the tools necessary to improve, and if they don't, it's purely on them alone. However the popular argument is that parsers are merely a shaming tool, and this is just not accurate. That would be like claiming fault with taking piano lessons when I can play by ear but can't read music. The larger majority of the playerbase can play by ear or merely repeat what they've seen/done, but it's only when you begin to not only see but understand just what you're doing and how well you're doing it do you truly improve.

So the idea that parsers aren't needed outside raids essentially supports the skill divide/gap between players (this in itself often leading to the old casual/elite nonsense). Not everyone is going to become Elton John, but we can all learn to play the piano better, even outside of raids.

[sackm]

wrong. those are actually the areas where parsers are needed the most, because that content is run way more often than endgame raids. 24mans in particular take WAY longer than they should because half the damn alliance is doing 150 dps when they should be doing 400.

[Elazu]

Got a pretty good point.

There's virtually NO need for parsers outside of end game raids. Putting it in your average 24 man or Daily roulette PUG is just harmful.

Not putting a parser in is actually harmful.

[Astral145]

What the devs should implement instead is an individual parser meaning you cant see other players parsers which I agree with. DCUO (F2P btw) finally implemented an individual parser a few months ago.

What the DCUO devs did was use the chat battle log to calculate all your damage done in a set time then show you your Damage Per Second, crit %'s, highest hit and total damage done in a set amount of time. The best part was you could set the time you want to see your current parser like every 30 secs, 60 secs or when you stopped doing battle. This allowed each individual to set goals like perfecting your opener and see how you were contributing to the fight..

You can even use this on a dummy to test out new load outs and rotations.

By using the chat battle log as a parser allowed the devs to implement this to all platforms ps3, ps4, pc...ect. PS3 and PS4 players did not suffer through any issues regarding this type of parser on DCUO so there is no reason as to why the FFXIV devs couldn't implement this into FFXIV

I haven't heard of any negative feed backs on the DCUO forums regarding the new parsers. All I read were praises and how thankful the community was for what the devs did.

[Lyrica_Ashtine]

Maybe you're right, but can you argue that they would be a very useful tool for many to improve?

You can also argue the contrary. In my previous post I mentioned it may motivate people to improve more. With the current situation, parsers are technically against the ToS, but considered as "tolerated" as long the GMs don't find out about it. You can talk about it with anyone, but if someone decides to report you for displaying parse results, then we get the exact opposite of the coin: a witch hunt for those who use parsers.

I'm not saying your list is wrong, but i believe the middle area would be players being afraid to use parsers, rather than not wanting to use them

[Clarkamite]

You can't blame the tool for a player's behaviour. That's on the same level as blaming a bicycle while cyclists are ignoring traffic rules.

I don't know if you thought I was serious or not but I wasn't. I was being completely sarcastic. I've been on the side of parsing since day one.

[Gorlioliolio]

These are the stupidest threads ever, got through 15 pages before I couldn't take it anymore so let me sum it up for anyone skipping to the end.


Bad Player - "I don't want parsers, people will kick me from groups"

Good Player - "But if you have parsers then you can improve and people won't kick you from groups as often"

Bad Player - "I don't want to improve, I want to push 1 2 3 repeatedly and waste everyones time"

Good Player - "But you are wasting multiple peoples time, over and over again, including your own"

Bad Player - "I don't care I pay my $15 each month to do what I want, if you kick me your a selfish elitist prick"

Good Player - "You do realize that wasting 3 peoples time is more selfish than wasting 1 persons time right?"

Bad Player - "How do you know I'm the one wasting peoples time, are you parsing? I'm gonna report you"

Good Player - Initiates votekick

Bad Player - Sits at GC house or idyllshire for 30 minutes while complaining on the forums that they got kicked

Other people on the forums - "You know if you had parsers you could try to improve and people wouldn't kick you"

Bad Player - "Your all elitist selfish pricks and I'm gonna report everyone"

Other people on forums - "There are multiple guides/youtube videos available to help you improve your gameplay, watch some, try it out maybe in the future people won't kick you all it takes is a little effort on your part"

Bad Player - "HARDCORE ELITIST A-HOLES"