The Real Problem with Parsers

[La_Bluegirl]

I will just leave this here to show you how parsers in general won't mean anything to the average player if we take WoW as an example.

https://youtu.be/GFWh9aY4pas?t=2m8s

It also highlights that the key issue is not about the numbers and is actually getting people to play to the best of their ability and not lowering the bar over and over.

The fact that we have DPS checks is the only reason that what happens in that video doesn't happen in this game.

I loved that you posted this. Unfortunately, most people against parsers will probably skip watching that video and continue to exaggerate the harrassment. People really are paranoid if you think just because you're 50 dps under someone else you're going to be vote kicked. People get vote kicked for not even bothering to try, not because you're slightly behind the other person. The only time I've vote kicked anyone was because they were literally doing equal dps as a fresh 50 in 2.0, while having plenty of i200 gear, or they just simply can't be bothered to (self admitting) stop chatting to their FC or linkshell and do more than auto attacking.

[Dante_V]

This game desperately needs damage meters. The OP is complete opinion by the way and has no fact to back his very weak hypothesis.

[CedricDur]

When I see this sort of talk brought up I think of the time I was playing a shadow priest over WoW and another shadow priest joined. I was doing 6k, he was doing 1k. Everyone who had a parser could see it and we paused, asked what he was doing, and it turns out he thought that using his DoTs and then use the skill that made them explode for 30% of the damage was a good move. We explained it wasn't, I told him to DoT normally, even as to only use one or two DoTs instead of doing the full gamut since mobs died too fast.

He went back up to 5k. Not topmost, but a ginormous improvement.

What I hear/read, when I see these sort of threads are people who want to do their unique builds and faceroll. Now, if they are all grouped together and of the same mind, that's fine, they fail, they get better or they continue failing. But the 1k wonder who, unlike that dude I mentioned who took the advice and cheerfuly left us at the end knowing better, is usually complaining does not want to conform AND still wants to win at his or her goal.

'I have my special build. I don't do cookie cutter builds!'
'...but you're doing 50% of the damage?'
'IT DOES NOT MATTER! I WILL NOT PLAY A COOKIE CUTTER BUILD!'

(I had this actual conversation once).



Even back in Neverwinter Nights I knew people who proudly took all the feats involving +2 to poison saving throws because 'they were role-playing a yuan-ti and it made sense for them to have it'. I don't think the mobs care one iota.


I note with some cynicism how this whole 'I got kicked because I did 50 DPS less' never seems to happen when asked around in the forums, or to friends, or mentioned to the guild, which leads me to think if 50 DPS was not rather 750 with just a little bit exaggeration in order to garner sympathy.

[karateorangutang]

Even back in Neverwinter Nights I knew people who proudly took all the feats involving +2 to poison saving throws because 'they were role-playing a yuan-ti and it made sense for them to have it'. I don't think the mobs care one iota.

Haha, thank you for taking me back in time to remember things like this.

[OPneedNerfs]

There's also a reason why they introduced a kick/vote abandon option.

[Aiselia]

There's also a reason why they introduced a kick/vote abandon option.

Yep, for cases of Harassment, Cheating, being AFK, or being offline.

[Elazu]

Yep, for cases of Harassment, Cheating, being AFK, or being offline.

Seeing that "different playstyles" is a legitimate reason to kick somebody, as confirmed by the GMs, it's perfectly fine to kick peole who don't meet the party's standard.

[Aiselia]

Seeing that "different playstyles" is a legitimate reason to kick somebody, as confirmed by the GMs, it's perfectly fine to kick peole who don't meet the party's standard.

And, as confirmed by the GMs, you should report every vote kick you think is bull, suggesting that "Different playstyles" isn't a catch-all excuse for everything.

[Waliel]

There is a time-limit on instances for a reason. SE determined that it might take a group upwards of 90 minutes to finish a set of instances. "Carrying your weight" needs to be weighed against those 90 minutes, not the 15-20 minute speed-runs demanded by bored players looking to gain tomes from some daily roulette and then complaining about all those folk who are slowing them down.

Yep, indeed there are different time checks for different contents. We have the 90 Mins limit for the average dungeon and even more for alliance-type content, as well as really tight time-check content like Savage. That's what SE seems to consider the reasonable time to clear.

The time limit was actually put in place in back in ARR closed beta so players would not hog all the instance servers for themselves by just sitting in there. It started at 60 minutes, but was raised to 90 after complaints that 60 felt too short sometimes. That was back when no one had played this game for longer than two weekends and barely knew how to activate auto-attack, the only dungeon available was Tam-tara at like level 20 or something, and you unlocked a tank for Tam-tara by talking to an NPC after getting your CNJ, ARC or LNC high enough. Fun times.

[Dante_V]

Parsers are an invaluable tool for people trying to get better and teams trying to progress. The community should absolutely have access to these tools in order to expand their game play and ability.

As far as the community goes, their will always be douchers and people who just want to harass others, this is completely independent of parsers and exist regardless. The claim that this would get any worse or better isn't necessarily based in fact or objective proof and aligns more with professing correlation as casualty.