The Real Problem with Parsers

[OPneedNerfs]

It's simple. Do it like many other games have come before it. Impose a punishment for making too many false reports.

If it doesn't discourage people from reporting just because their fee fees were hurt, at least they'd get punished and would open their eyes to how it's not just all about "me".

[Aiselia]

It's simple. Do it like many other games have come before it. Impose a punishment for making too many false reports.

Brilliant, and then they can lose paying customers because not only do they feel the players are attacking them, they can feel like SE wants the players to keep attacking them because THEY are the ones getting punished for feeling attacked enough to report!

Do I need to add a sarcasm tag, or we good there?

[OPneedNerfs]

Brilliant, and then they can lose paying customers because not only do they feel the players are attacking them, they can feel like SE wants the players to keep attacking them because THEY are the ones getting punished for feeling attacked enough to report!

Do I need to add a sarcasm tag, or we good there?

You're assuming them being able to report but nothing getting done will make them stay longer.

If nothing changes on their end, the "harassment" won't magically stop or disappear.

Worse yet, the people who actually know how to play will burn out from running into too many of these special snowflakes that they would eventually quit as well.

Do I need to add a sarcasm tag, or we good there?

[Aiselia]

You're assuming them being able to report but nothing getting done will make them stay longer.

If they don't know if nothing's getting done because they're not told either way, turning the punishment around back to them is a surefire way to get them to quit. Good luck trying to convince SE with your argument. "Hey, go institute a policy that will make you lose money because I don't want to deal with bads any more, kthx."

Worse yet, the people who actually know how to play will burn out from running into too many of these special snowflakes that they would eventually quit as well.

Or they'll learn how to premake parties and group with people they know are good. Either way, someone's got to learn something.

[OPneedNerfs]

If they don't know if nothing's getting done because they're not told either way, turning the punishment around back to them is a surefire way to get them to quit. Good luck trying to convince SE with your argument. "Hey, go institute a policy that will make you lose money because I don't want to deal with bads any more, kthx."

So your argument is that:

People who know how to play a game and are willing to invest their time and effort into it suck it up or quit

in defense of people who don't know how to play and can't be bothered to do better?

Or they'll learn how to premake parties and group with people they know are good. Either way, someone's got to learn something.

I'm not even gonna start with how you think the DF is only for bads due to JP/NA server differences we've obviously experienced.

If, hypothetically speaking, everyone follows your advice and "learn how to premake parties and group with people they know are good", wouldn't the bunch you're defending quit because nothing would get done? No tanks or healers who want to deal with low dps and let's be real here, anyone who doesn't bother to learn basic dps rotations won't be bothered to tank/heal. Better yet, they DO go into a tank/heal class yet can't hold threat/keep people alive.

[Souljacker]

I believe the mistreatment is exaggerated. Being removed from a party because you weren't carrying your weight does not equate abuse. No one is entitled to the time of 3-7-23 other people. There's an epidemic in society today where anyone who gets in trouble looks outside themselves for the reason it happened. This is no different. Someone was removed from a group not because they were underperforming, but because "parsers", which is an effective bogeyman and lets them ignore the real issue of the underperformance. If we vilify parsers, we don't have to look at ourselves and the things we are doing wrong.

With this game's challenging rotations a parser is needed. It would be nice if it was an official one.

[DPZ2]

I believe the mistreatment is exaggerated. Being removed from a party because you weren't carrying your weight does not equate abuse. No one is entitled to the time of 3-7-23 other people. There's an epidemic in society today where anyone who gets in trouble looks outside themselves for the reason it happened.

There is a time-limit on instances for a reason. SE determined that it might take a group upwards of 90 minutes to finish a set of instances. "Carrying your weight" needs to be weighed against those 90 minutes, not the 15-20 minute speed-runs demanded by bored players looking to gain tomes from some daily roulette and then complaining about all those folk who are slowing them down.

In a Story Mode Instance, the expectation should be "it takes as much time as it takes".

For Extremes and Raids, go ahead an knock yourself out.

[EdenLife]

There is a time-limit on instances for a reason. SE determined that it might take a group upwards of 90 minutes to finish a set of instances. "Carrying your weight" needs to be weighed against those 90 minutes, not the 15-20 minute speed-runs demanded by bored players looking to gain tomes from some daily roulette and then complaining about all those folk who are slowing them down.

In a Story Mode Instance, the expectation should be "it takes as much time as it takes".

For Extremes and Raids, go ahead an knock yourself out.

Yep, indeed there are different time checks for different contents. We have the 90 Mins limit for the average dungeon and even more for alliance-type content, as well as really tight time-check content like Savage. That's what SE seems to consider the reasonable time to clear.

[CGMidlander]

There is a time-limit on instances for a reason. SE determined that it might take a group upwards of 90 minutes to finish a set of instances. "Carrying your weight" needs to be weighed against those 90 minutes, not the 15-20 minute speed-runs demanded by bored players looking to gain tomes from some daily roulette and then complaining about all those folk who are slowing them down.

In a Story Mode Instance, the expectation should be "it takes as much time as it takes".

For Extremes and Raids, go ahead an knock yourself out.

Be honest -- do you actually want your dungeon runs to take the whole 90 minutes?

20 minutes is not a speed run, btw. Many DF parties are capable of completing our current dungeons around that time going at a fairly leisurely pace. (Like, not even big pulling)

Yep, indeed there are different time checks for different contents. We have the 90 Mins limit for the average dungeon and even more for alliance-type content, as well as really tight time-check content like Savage. That's what SE seems to consider the reasonable time to clear.

Or perhaps it's also time provisioning in case someone disconnects or leaves the party and a replacement needs to be found?

[PotatoWafflez]

I will just leave this here to show you how parsers in general won't mean anything to the average player if we take WoW as an example.

https://youtu.be/GFWh9aY4pas?t=2m8s

It also highlights that the key issue is not about the numbers and is actually getting people to play to the best of their ability and not lowering the bar over and over.

The fact that we have DPS checks is the only reason that what happens in that video doesn't happen in this game.