Tank adjustments we can agree on?

[Nektulos-Tuor]

I think Clem should be 1.5s cast because they are a tank.

If WAR gets this buff then something will have to take a hit, and quite drastically, because SE will have made a class with an incredibly important strength, and no significant weakness in sight.

No, bugs should be "fixed" there is no reason a heal should not work with something. Less you suddenly want to make other tank stances not work with some types of damage.

[FriendlyUncle]

I think Clem should be 1.5s cast because they are a tank.



No, bugs should be "fixed" there is no reason a heal should not work with something. Less you suddenly want to make other tank stances not work with some types of damage.

This isn't a bug, look at your tooltip ffs. Defiance: Increases HP recovery via healing magic by 20% for self. Lustrate is a healing ability. There is a clearly defined difference between spell and a spell-like ability in the game.

[MeeYow]

I said this as well.

Apparently it's an accepted bug according to a poster not long after.

Still waiting on sauce.

With regard to OP; most of the PLD changes are QoL or exchanging (removing!) one tool for another, the WAR one is an undeniable buff. PLD needs more, especially if WAR is being buffed.

Edit: spelling.

[Gooner_iBluAirJGR]

Still waiting on sauce.

No kidding. I've been at this table for over an hour and they haven't brought me my sauce either ffs. The service here is deplorable.

p.s. there are no tank adjustments we can all agree on.

#EndlessArgument

[MeeYow]

No kidding. I've been at this table for over an hour and they haven't brought me my sauce either ffs. The service here is deplorable.

Umm...

Welcome to the party, fashionably late as always.

We have plenty of dip, but no sauce

[Alahra]

Apparently it's an excepted bug according to a poster not long after.

Even if something is moved to the "Accepted" section of the Bug Reports forums, it doesn't mean it's actually a bug. It means the Bug Report was filed correctly and it will be looked into, not that the bug has actually been confirmed. If it was accepted and is no longer there, they've probably realized it's not a bug.

Yoshi's statement in regards to this seems to confirm that, as he was pretty clear that Lustrate and the rest don't increase specifically because they're abilities. It's an annoying issue. It also affects self-healing buffs with the most annoying example being Dissipation. Sacrifice your fairy for a 20% healing potency buff and get 3 Aetherflow stacks, the Lustrates/Indomitabilities from which don't gain any benefit of the boost.

They probably won't change it unless they decide healing potencies need a boost in general, though.

[Yorumi]

This isn't a bug, look at your tooltip ffs. Defiance: Increases HP recovery via healing magic by 20% for self. Lustrate is a healing ability. There is a clearly defined difference between spell and a spell-like ability in the game.

The interesting thing is before 3.0 the main healing abilities were affected by defiance just in a slightly different way. Both benediction and lustrate where percent max hp and defiance raised max hp so it affected those abilities. It's ultimately an absolutely stupid decision that healing abilities arn't affected by healing buffs. Sch for example has a skill that gives them aetherflow stacks and a bonus to healing output. Except it doesn't work with any skill that actually uses the aetherflow stacks they got. On top of that shield oath and grit don't reduce the healing received by abilities so why should warrior's tank stance in effect do that?

Don't want that added to war? Fine then I say shield oath and grit should have a new effect added "reduces healing received by healing abilities by 20%."

[Brian_]

PLD changes:

Oaths off the GCD, no longer breaks combos. You can already drop Shield Oath oGCD to negate the damage penalty. You are only spending a GCD to gain the AA bonus from SwO. Just change it already. At the very least, there needs to be some streamlining with Oaths because the current way it works is just a mess.

Buff Rage of Halone's potency and/or the enmity modifier of Savage Blade and RoH to be equal to WAR / DRK enmity combos. This is an unacceptable fundamental imbalance that exists only for archaic reasons. How this wasn't changed for HW's release just shows a blatant lack of foresight.

Buff Shield Swipe's potency to be above the average potency of the RoH / RA / GB combos. Buff the enmity modifier to be above the enmity generated by the average of the RoH combo. Consider the design change of allowing shield swipe to activate RoH / RA / GB combo bonuses. Shield Swipe's efficiency is still balanced based on 2.X standards just like RoH. The skill in unusable currently and fixing it would help PLD DPS, enmity generation, and TP management. A must change.

Change Shelltron to 1~2 seconds of 100% block rate and change the MP recovery accordingly. As is, it's incredibly inconsistent. Half the time an auto-attack will eat it up. The other half of the time, you're trying to time it so closely that the server does not update in time for it to register. With this change, your timing still needs to be exact but at least you can get it to consistently block what you want it to block.

Add ~50 potency to Flash (traited). Lower Circle of Scorn CD or buff CoS damage and apply the enmity modifier to the DoT. PLD AoE enmity and damage are just straight up horrible. Their mitigation in AoE situations is tangibly better than DRK / WAR but that still does not justify having 500+ less DPS and garbage tier enmity in AS2.

Shield Bash no longer breaks combos. Reduce start-up to 0 frame (instant) hit confirmation. TP cost reduced to <40. It's okay to leave it on the GCD but it's not okay that it's so cumbersome to use as an actual interrupt. Since you have everyone spamming their oGCD stuns for extra DPS and triggering DR, the extra duration is often irrelevant. In the end, you're left with a stun that is GCD locked so squeezing it into an interrupt window is much harder, it interrupts your combos, AND it costs a boatload of TP that you're already starved on. Fix it. How it hasn't been fixed yet is embarrassing.

Divine Veil. Either buff it to 20%+ or make it so it requires no trigger and has a lower CD. As is, it's a weak shield on par with Succor that has a long CD, requires an activator, and is generally super clunky to use.

Clemency. It's complete garbage. Redesign it completely. I don't understand the idea behind this skill at all. Are Paladins supposed to be healing? Because they certainly can't while taking hits as an MT. Are they supposed to be healing while OTing? Because that's 3 seconds of 0 DPS on content that healers have no issues healing already. The only way I see this working is if it's instant cast on a longer CD like Tetragrammaton. Maybe then it would be comparable to Equilibrium.

[shao32]

this changes are dps focus, whe are tanks, i dont care if they can dealt good dps, but in tanking mode and dps mode i think they need more diference, dps stance need more penalty from tanking capacity, thats become the clases more hard to play, DRK have both stances up all time but grit if no up can make darkside some penalty in some actions, something like make all defensive action to 50% less efective, thats would be great.

and for shield oath and grit i prefer if removed the 20% reduction and change for 20% armor extra, and make change like paladin 30% of phisycal defense and 20% magic defense in shiel oath, and dark knight the same but magic 30% and phisyical 20%.

extra potency in skills nop, but put blunt defense down in shield swipe can help to make drk and pld teams whit monks, and for defiance and heal from certain skills i agree.

if i can say something mi proposal is remove VIT and make vigor stat, al clases can take extra vit from vigor but tanks base they damage from vigor, thats make less diversity in gear configuration yes, but is more importan end this sad war form str vs vit.

and if they still maintain the parry skills like that, change parry stat from chance to incrrese parry str only and end of the story to, or still chance but the str scale whit vigor.

[Misha_Tameshigiri]

Darkside is DRK's version of Maim. Except it's worse because it's coupled with constant MP drain.
It's not a DPS stance. At all.