Idea: Split Archer into Bard and Ranger

[Vinestra]

No. Aside from the issues that come from branching class (see SCH and SMN balancing), it does not change the fact that WM itself will still cause the class job that has it to play awkwardly if they still have archer's skillset.

It also does not work with the current meta on party composition. Unless you want ranger to compete with casters for the dps spot (which means no spell damage)

One of the major reasons why Smn/Sch balancing was awkward was because they filled two different roles: Buff Summoners arcanists skills damage and Scholar gets buffed. Also the conflicting stats didn't help. But yeah, it wouldn't really change much in the way of playstyle without something, gimmicky being added in to the ranger skills.

[rachcouture]

I would greatly appreciate a SMN/SCH-like split. Ranger could focus on DPS and Bard on songs and other support tools as opposed to the underwhelming mish-mash we have now.

That combined with recast and animation tweaks to make Wanderer's Minuet flow properly would have me interested in equipping a bow again.

[liljramos88]

Branching classes could be still viable in FF14 not at this moment but in the future yes the reason why is that the new skills are job specific and the Exp gain given is to the base class right know we just increase to lvl 60 and only gain a a few abilities let's asume that we get 4 new skills each for every ten lvl. So by the time we have the lvl cap of 80 for example we could have enough skills to change the gameplay of a class. Let's assume You lvl up Bard to 80 your base clas is at 80 right know all the skills that you learned so far are all bards skills. You get a job quest to get ranger at 80 so all those skills from let's say 50 and onward will be given to you witch is enough to change the rotation at that point and bc u already lvl up Archer to 80. Another reason will be trares we don't have anymore they stop after you hit 50

[RiceisNice]

...

Button bloating. Unless the new skills are going to directly replace the class skills (like Broil and Stone III). And even then, this is on the basis that we have a level cap of 80 which is in the very very far future. If they wanted to make branching jobs work, they're better off doing it sooner and redoing the classing system so their inherent playstyle will change as soon as they equip the job crystal, much like duelle's example

[AeirTalies]

Interesting idea enough, although it would be hard to decide which one you are with Bows being their weapons for both, maybe making the job be "Sniper" similar to the one in Tactics using Crossbows instead being a less spelly feel.

[Stormfur]

I'd play archer in a split second if I got to be a ranger. Would be interesting to see a mix of archer/summoner in that the ranger could call beasts to his side a-la dragon age.

[Noelzzz]

much like duelle's example

That is what everyone would like to have

[Shurrikhan]

I Think I'll go ahead and try my hand at a revision.

Gameplay synopsis:

Archer

Though the Archer lacks the combo dynamics of other jobs, it does have plenty of dynamics of its own. The Archer has two stances, Quick Draw and Full Draw, the extent of which vary with bow type. Optimal play dances between the two, maximizing Quick Draw for speed, oGCD refresh, and auto-attacks, and Full Draw for heavier damage and stacked oGCD nukes. Though the Archer's skillgap has increased somewhat, so too has its versatility. In addition to a wide range of CDs at its disposal, the Archer can stack resources above their optimal point for more burst, and can sacrifice bits of damage rate to more quickly attack or affect enemies in quick succession. Its utility is not as great as some other classes, but its range, movement, and dps control make it an incredibly useful class for any team.

Bard

The Archer's support variant, the Bard, builds on the dynamics of the fight and party composition itself through the use of songs. Though the Bard is slightly weaker in base attack power than its source class, it is able to make up these differences personally through its new mechanics and several-fold through the songs those mechanics support. The Bard essentially works within up to 8 stances, combinations of its two source stances, and the subtler nuances of its four songs (Army's Paeon, Mage's Ballad, Foe Requiem, and Windsong), which each alter certain mechanics and the nature of certain damaging abilities. The Bard provides significant overall bonuses to raid damage (most notably via casters) and longevity. Songs can be started and affected or altered quickly, but their full use is characterized by casts and intensified drain on the Bard's mana, and in part their damage.

Ranger

The Ranger is essentially the opposite side of the coin from Bard. Rather than focusing on the battlefield through one's party, it prefers to look at the points of interest among its many targets. The Ranger tends more towards Full Draw and to longbows than the Archer or Bard, but is still plenty mobile through its abilities even then, especially if willing to sacrifice certain of its highly versatile resources. The most notable among these resources are its ammunition, which provide a similar range of nuance to Bard songs, but in a distinct style. Ammunition acts both as weapon- and mechanical-augmentation and as the resource cost for certain abilities. The Ranger still carries a fair bit of support, but of a very specific and typically offensive nature. All but a few of the Ranger's abilities play out into its rotation, but due to the utility embedded in several, the order by which these are used, sometimes at slight cost, can go a long way in supporting a group. It is no more technical than the Bard, but its intricacies are often sharper and play out more according to the Ranger's own arsenal than the party as a whole.

Other early notes:

• Full Draw replaces Wanderer's Minuet, and is slightly a lighter variant, especially in implementation or introduction. It initially affects only Heavy Shot, and by only by reducing movement speed while readying the shot while increasing damage, accuracy, and cast rate with the time spent stationary. It gradually affects more abilities with increased levels, across three traits (in place of the basic +%damage traits, which is partly afforded by default and partly through these stances), while the effects of mechanics available without Full Draw (called, for convenience, Quick Draw) increase. Its effect on animations has been vastly improved.
• The weapon speed of one's bow has an effect on the cast times and animation speeds of several abilities, including all those affected by Full Draw. Choice of bow does not necessarily advantage one stance over another, but will slightly change how they are used.
• Bard songs are now used not only for raid support but also personal mechanics, and their support elements have different levels of range and deployment, ranging from point-support (on or around a particular target, enemy or ally) to affecting nearby allies with your personal mechanics, to standard widely dispersed raid support. Mana costs similarly vary.
• Ranger-unique abilities add certain complicators and priorities to their original Archer arsenal, but little need be only for the sake of damage. The overall damage of a Ranger lies between a Ninja's and a Black Mage's, but the Ranger still provides a fair amount of utility. It is simply less universally useful than that of a Ninja. Its full usage, also, due to ammunition cost, is often more 'emergency only'.

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P.S. At this point I don't find WM awkward at all. If anything I find pre-WM Bard somewhat flat, just post-WM's stance-dancing to be a bit too limited. Overall I simply find WM a wasted opportunity to do more or do better, and that it was far too large a change to implement in a single level, let alone to give to the job rather than the class. Full Draw, therefore, implemented in a few different trait augmentations alongside no-FD mechanical extensions, seemed the obvious choice to me. Stance dancing returned, clunkiness mitigated (especially with shortbows), application and learning curve smoothed.

I realize that the above version of Ranger as anything less than a purest form of DPSer might not appeal to some, but I have trouble envisioning enough difference or synergy between its possible abilities to feel fleshed out without a bit of embedded and optional utility. I intend for it to appeal both to those who can like MCH for its myriad priorities but dislike its downtime, and for those who dislike its clunkiness prior to mastering it and don't which to spend quite so much time and attention looking at their bars instead of thinking about incoming phases and opportunities to maximize its CDs as a part of the fight itself (rather than CD synergy).

(Personally I still think MCH could use some identity improvements as well, such as by spending it's -5% magic/physical damage done abilities on more mechanical (read: robotics- or gunnery-related) things, and that Gauss Barrel ought to at least change its animation to warrant its cast times. It works in button-flow, but it makes no visual sense.)

[XiXiQ]

I really, really miss the old bard - was my second main. Being a blm main as well, very used to standing still and the cast times, etc WM didn't daunt me much, just disappointed to find that the 2 jobs that were so different became pretty much the same.

[Jilliebeans]

i actually do support the ideas, NOT that i dont like the bard the way it is BUT I do feel like for an archer with cast time seems a bit silly to me "imo". I do really hope to see bard/archer will be separate in the future, while ARCHER can focus on 100% dps and bard can focus more on buffing and dps if they can. I did enjoy the old bard, its fit their roles perfectly in group.