Colored gear with specific classes.

[Kiote]

Uniqueness between classes, not within a class.

To which lengths is the strawman going to continue?

Every Warrior with AF is going to look the same, but no warrior will look the same as a dragoon. Save your bitching for that time, cause that's gonna be game-breaking.

I'm sure when everyone was asking for class uniqueness they meant different pallettes of DRG AF wearable by WAR's and PLD's.

Why would you want to look the same as every other warrior?

[Oscillate_Wildly]

Lol. Each class has its own distinctive color scheme for their respective equipment. That is the very definition of the term unique.

That makes no sense. All classes can wear red, all classes have some shade of blue, and on and on and so forth. of course the hues will be a bit different as you go from cloth to metal, but it sounds like you're saying what now...That no class will ever get Sea Foam green except mages? That's true but if that's what you're saying you've completely missed the point yet again.
Please use big, complicated words with examples to make your point. I have this feeling that you don't quite understand what changed.

here's what I'm saying.
Right now we have for example, a Cobalt Plate Mail, and it comes in undyed, and dyed in red. It can only be worn by 2 classes. This alone should be 'unique' as there are specific restrictions on who can wear it.

The red verison has an extra bonus stat over the Undyed version making it better stat-wise. Now explain how marauders and Gladiators both wearing the set in red are any more unique than say one wearing undyed, while the other wears red?

Once more. If you are a conjurer who heals, you'll look exactly the same colour-scheme wise, as the other conjurers who are going for base stats based in healing. You'll all be wearing green felt robes. How is that in anyway unique amongst yourselves by wearing the same set, in the same colour?

Before you could wear the same armour sets, except in the colour of your choosing. You could even wear it undyed. No longer.

You seem to think that the only way to make classes unique are to chain colours to them and make all what....All archers yellow, while making all Pugilists blue? Are we playing the board game Sorry? I'm /really/ confused by your stance on this as you seem to be in favour of removing all uniqueness in favour of making everyone dress the same.

[Gidonoidon_Sur]

Color affecting stats = dumb.

/end thread

[Betelgeuzah]

The Color itself has no impact on the Stat. It is a combination of Color+Armour that determine the stats.

So what? Items are separated by the classes that can wear them. Red robe is not the same as red Haubergeon. Red Haubergeon separates GLA from MRD, while Red robe separates THM from CNJ. They fulfill their purpose perfectly. You don't mix a red haubergeon with a red robe, unless, as you said, you are mentally ill. They are completely different models, and as such can share the same color while creating class uniqueness (through the model (haubergeon wearable by "4 classes") AND through the color (red haubergeon suited for GLA)).

All classes can wear red

All classes have separate armor models which are then further divided to different colors that are suited just for them. Every class has its own theme, whether it be red haubergeon or red robe. That is class uniqueness.

[Oscillate_Wildly]

Uniqueness between classes, not within a class.

To which lengths is the strawman going to continue?

Every Warrior with AF is going to look the same, but no warrior will look the same as a dragoon. Save your bitching for that time, cause that's gonna be game-breaking.

I'm sure when everyone was asking for class uniqueness they meant different pallettes of DRG AF wearable by WAR's and PLD's.

yes except we're both arguing different things. I'm in favour of uniqueness WITHIN THE SAME CLASS, meaing I'd like to NOT look like every other Conjurer across the server. You seem to be arguing against me for uniqueness CROSS CLASS which I'm in favour of as well. Which you've gotten in this update as armours are currently restricted to class and level. Which can be good, alright? Jesus.

And that's what AF is, I personally don't care about AF as it's never a game breaker and never will be. I liked my iconic red mage gear, and it never lasted. What will last are craftables. So the dye system shouldn't directly affect stats which they currently, as of this update, do. Go look up the same piece of armour for mages in different colours, all will have different bonus stats according to the colour of dye used. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE AGAINST.


For example, what if AF's came out with different colours, but the only one actually useful was in Red? And that you wanted to wear Blue? Well too bad, base stat-wise it'd be against you. So why should dyes be linked to stats at all?

[Kiote]

All classes have separate armor models which are then further divided to different colors that are suited just for them. Every class has its own theme, whether it be red haubergeon or red robe. That is class uniqueness.

Your definition of Class uniqueness is completely distorted. What you are talking about is forced Conformity. That is in no way unique. One thing that is the exact same as every other thing it is related to can never be unique.

[Betelgeuzah]

I'm in favour of uniqueness WITHIN THE SAME CLASS

You can't have uniqueness within the same class without first having uniqueness between classes.

A Dragoon AF that is in 4 colors is not unique to Dragoons if 4 other classes can wear it all the same. It's just a generic armor that looks like it was made for Dragoon, but everyone uses it in all colors.

[Oscillate_Wildly]

Oh my Gooood you are so ridiculous you're still missing the point.

DYES SHOULD BE FOR AESTHETIC PURPOSES ONLY. THAT IS THE POINT OF THIS ARGUMENT. What are you even TALKING about? You're so turned around you're arguing for something that's completely POINTLESS. Of course a red haub won't resemble a red robe.

haubs and robes NEVER RESEMBLED ONE ANOTHER IN THE FIRST PLACE.
Haubs for example never gave huge chunks of MP while simultaneously giving you +INT.

HOWEVER. A red robe and a green robe should resemble one another with their stats as they ARE the same piece of armour, they are just different COLOURS. The stats shouldn't change just because the colour of the item changed. NOT WITHIN THE SAME PIECE OF EQUIPMENT.

THAT'S WHAT MATERIA IS FOR NOW.

[Betelgeuzah]

DYES SHOULD BE FOR AESTHETIC PURPOSES ONLY.

That's just your opinion, while you offer no viable alternatives to create class uniqueness either.

The current dye system creates aesthetical uniqueness between classes. That is the end of it. No caps lock will change that.

[Oscillate_Wildly]

You can't have uniqueness within the same class without first having uniqueness between classes.

A Dragoon AF that is in 4 colors is not unique to Dragoons if 4 other classes can wear it all the same. It's just a generic armor that looks like it was made for Dragoon, but everyone uses it in all colors.

What the hell are you even talking about? Are you drunk? Colour =/= class. Colours are for aesthetics. Why would you even say that 4 colours = 4 different classes that can wear it? Are you completely mental?


Let me spell it out for you.

Dragoon AF: Comes in 3 colours. Only the Dragoon can wear it. ONLY THE DRAGOON CAN WEAR IT.
1st colour: +attack
2nd colour: +accuracy
3rd colour: +mnd, or piet, or intelect.

The distinction should not exist. Forget for a minute if you're going to argue about it, that this is about AF, because this what current crafting gear looks like. The stats change within the same piece of equipment depending on what colour you pick even if that goes against the colour you want.

IF you wanted or needed attack, clearly you'd pick the 1st one even if it went against the colour you wanted.
The mere fact that colour = stats is ABSOLUTELY BAFFLING.