Colored gear with specific classes.

[Abriael]

It's obvious that in the latest wave of hirings SE let an Ork slip into the development team.

Red ones go fastah!

[Amineri]

I have been having a bit of trouble adjusting to the new color paradigm, but in the end I think it will lead to the game having a more Final Fantasy feel to it.

First off, most MMOs have color be purely aesthetic. This is not most MMOs. The biggest complaint I see from people is that they don't want FFXIV turning into a generic MMO clone.

In the Final Fantasy universe, color is not aesthetic!

Black Mage != White Mage != Red Mage != Blue Mage

People are crying out for these traditional Final Fantasy job icons, and yet turn around and raise a ruckus because SE actually ties colors to classes?? I don't get it. The whole theme of these classes (EVEN THEIR NAMES) are highly dependent on color.

Even beyond that, there is a clear line of reasoning as to why colors have stats associated with them. People generally liked the dyeing system (or at least SE believed this to be the case, it seems), where you had to collect dyes and add them to gear. With the HQ system, and crafting in general, this means that adding color takes more effort. Should not effort be rewarded? I know that pre-patch, I was starting to see a lot of people in undyed +3 gear, because the undyed version was exactly the same stat-wise, but easier to make.

If you follow this train of logic, if SE makes dyes not affect stats, no one will make/sell HQ versions of the dyed gear. It would simply be more effort for no more reward. Once again, all people would look the same, just in this case undyed rather then dyed.

The only remaining choice is to make changing color such a trivial operation that it becomes essentially no effort to change your gear to whatever you want, whenever, however. This goes very highly against the color-themed classes/jobs that are so central to the Final Fantasy universe, that I'd think that more people would be against it.

Even further, then SE would be spending a lot of time adding in a system that served no actual game-related purpose. I can already see the cries of "SE, stop wasting time adding stuff to let people play dress-up, and put in REAL content!!".

SE couldn't really win here. No matter what option they took, there was going to be an outcry:
1) Keep existing system : "This is too complicated, and everyone ends up wearing the same undyed gear. It doesn't feel Final Fantasy."
2) Make colors have stats and class/job restrictions : "I can't make my character be whatever color I want!"
3) Make coloring a meaningless vanity system : "Why are you wasting time on a 'Hello Kitty' dress up system instead of adding real content? Why are the Black Mages dressed in red gear and Red Mages dressed in black gear? This makes no sense and isn't Final Fantasy!"

Good luck dev team! /salute

[Jynx]

In the Final Fantasy universe, color is not aesthetic!

I don't even know where to start with this comment...

[Oscillate_Wildly]

AF is one thing, crafted gear is another. Not to mention Conjurer does not equal black mage or white mage. That's jobs. As we don't have jobs yet, this whole class = colour nonsense is bunk. Particularly as that's not exactly how FF games have been going in the past few years anyway.

[Amineri]

AF is one thing, crafted gear is another. Not to mention Conjurer does not equal black mage or white mage. That's jobs. As we don't have jobs yet, this whole class = colour nonsense is bunk. Particularly as that's not exactly how FF games have been going in the past few years anyway.

Saying "class = colour nonsense is bunk" is your opinion.

Let me point out:
1) Color defining classes / jobs / roles has a well established tradition in the Final Fantasy universe
2) There were many requests for classes to be more well defined

I don't think it is too difficult to put these two things together to see where the dev team got this idea from.

[DeadRiser]

Saying "class = colour nonsense is bunk" is your opinion.

Let me point out:
1) Color defining classes / jobs / roles has a well established tradition in the Final Fantasy universe
2) There were many requests for classes to be more well defined

I don't think it is too difficult to put these two things together to see where the dev team got this idea from.

But that's what you have gear for. Not the color. The look itself is what can define your job. The color is your own customization. With the way things are now, everyone will be either red for MRD or GLA, [insert color] for mage, and [insert color] for ARC, LNC, and PUG. There's no fun and that's why I liked it before better.

[Rubicon]

Saying "class = colour nonsense is bunk" is your opinion.

Let me point out:
1) Color defining classes / jobs / roles has a well established tradition in the Final Fantasy universe
2) There were many requests for classes to be more well defined

I don't think it is too difficult to put these two things together to see where the dev team got this idea from.

With this logic, let's ask a Level 50 THM what their unofficial "AF" is. A red hat, a purple robe, green gloves, blue pants, and white shoes? Sure if they want the best stats. Or they could try to wear the same color clothes (let's pretend that THMs are meant to be purple) and not have the best stats. Not having ultimate stats doesn't sound very AF-ish to me.

I wish people would quit referring to AF. I seriously doubt classes will even get an AF, as an AF's stats supports a specific role and classes aren't meant to perform one specific role, they can mix and match abilities. Jobs will get AF because players will know what role a job is meant to play and the gear's stats will support that role.

[Amineri]

With this logic, let's ask a Level 50 THM what their unofficial "AF" is. A red hat, a purple robe, green gloves, blue pants, and white shoes? Sure if they want the best stats. Or they could try to wear the same color clothes (let's pretend that THMs are meant to be purple) and not have the best stats. Not having ultimate stats doesn't sound very AF-ish to me.

I wish people would quit referring to AF. I seriously doubt classes will even get an AF, as an AF's stats supports a specific role and classes aren't meant to perform one specific role, they can mix and match abilities. Jobs will get AF because players will know what role a job is meant to play and the gear's stats will support that role.

I'm not trying to say that classes are getting artifact armor (whatever that is, I presume it's some FFXI reference, which I never played). I'm also not saying that this is an exact repeat of a previous system from a previous Final Fantasy title.

All I'm trying to say here, is this : color intrinsically has a meaning beyond aesthetics in at least some of the Final Fantasy universe. The development team is building upon this, creating a system in which colors are in some ways associated with stats.

There are many degrees of freedom here.

On one side there are games in which both the color and the appearance have NOTHING to do with stats of gear. In Aion you could wield a fish, or a giant fork, with complete effectiveness. The upcoming game The Secret World (a modern-day conspiracy-type game) completely divorces your gear appearance from your stats. Great. That is one option.

In the middle ground, the physical model of the gear is restricted (i.e. robes for mages, plate for tanks, leather for DD), but the color is completely unrestricted. Lots of people are used to this way of thinking, and so think that it is "right". It's not right per se, just one more option on the design spectrum.

On the other side, both physical model of gear AND color can be restricted. Final Fantasy has a tradition of doing this. It seems to go against the current trend of MMOs, but do all MMOs really have to be the same?

On a side note, SE has clearly made the following color-to-element associations within the game, from day one:

Purple : lightning
White/light blue : ice
Red : Fire
Green : Wind
Tan/Brown : Earth
Blue : Water

Color here DOES matter.

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On a side note, I hope that SE does expand on their selection of armors and colors available within the classes, simply by adding more recipes/options. Given the sheer size of the 1.19 patch, I'm not really surprised that the new recipe selection first released was a bit skimpy, and am looking forward to more gear coming in 1.20.

[Deminia]

I'm not trying to say that classes are getting artifact armor (whatever that is, I presume it's some FFXI reference, which I never played). I'm also not saying that this is an exact repeat of a previous system from a previous Final Fantasy title.

All I'm trying to say here, is this : color intrinsically has a meaning beyond aesthetics in at least some of the Final Fantasy universe. The development team is building upon this, creating a system in which colors are in some ways associated with stats.
(edited out parts for length)
On a side note, SE has clearly made the following color-to-element associations within the game, from day one:

Purple : lightning
White/light blue : ice
Red : Fire
Green : Wind
Tan/Brown : Earth
Blue : Water

Color here DOES matter.

--------------------------------------------------------

On a side note, I hope that SE does expand on their selection of armors and colors available within the classes, simply by adding more recipes/options. Given the sheer size of the 1.19 patch, I'm not really surprised that the new recipe selection first released was a bit skimpy, and am looking forward to more gear coming in 1.20.

Yes, AF refers to the class limited quest reward gear from FFXI.

While I agree with some of your points - SE does indeed have a history of assigning elemental strengths/weaknesses with colors - I do not see where this makes much sense in appearance of the crafted gear we wear.

We have materia to add stats to gear, and the materia can be color coded. Spell effects can be color coded as well so it is clear that a sword is slashing away with ice magic laced on the blade or a mage has just thrown a thunder spell because the bolt has purple sparkles shooting out of it - all that would be just fine with me.

When I look at players in my party or running past me through town, I don't look at their gear and think "oh that Lalafell is wearing a red outfit - must be a Gladiator!" I do notice if the gear is made of metal, cloth or leather. I know that if a player is wearing a coatee set, that player is most likely set to a crafting class - and the tool equipped lets me know at a glance which craft. The gear sets already let me know at a glance which class the player is likely on, the color should have remained the player's style preference.

For unique class restricted gear sets (such as something similar to FFXI's Artifact Armor) that signify a particular uniform, then I don't mind certain colors. Typically in uniforms, all of the pieces have already been designed to look nicely together anyway. When AF was worn in FFXI, it meant that player had done a hard quest chain, had attained a certain number of levels and was now a "Red Mage" or a "Warrior" etc. For Grand Company gear or other similar gear sets, color is again applied to indicate the allegiance to the chosen company - and again, the gear is designed to match when worn as a set. I am fine with this concept.

However, for crafted gear that several jobs can use, I don't want every color to indicate what stats are on the gear. The result is a confusing mixture of colors that don't all blend together well. It also removes individuality. Why does every player who wants certain stats have to wear the exact same matching color gloves? I don't like the decision to extend color to stats in crafted gear for multiple class pieces. This is especially true for sets where we can't dye all pieces of the set the same color.

Part of the dev response was that color could not be applied to every item - I am OK with that if it needs to be that way. However, I still don't see why a crafted glove in one color vs another should have different stats. I love that we can first make a plain uncolored version of a piece of gear and then apply color to it later - that part is what we asked for. Changing the stats and restricting which classes can wear the item merely by dying the item a new color was not.

[Dreamer]

Forget color coding; I simply wish SE would take a page from the modern MMO design handbook (something I don't advocate very often) and separate appearance from stats. LotRO (a free2play game, at that) does this better than any other MMORPG I've played. You have your gear, then you have several different appearance-only tabs that you can switch between at will.