AST, MCH, DRK and their failure as new jobs at HW launch

[AppropriateName8544]

2 months since we got to HW, and it's hard not to acknowledge the failure those 3 jobs were 2 months ago, even if they really had a great potential.

AST has great ideas but it's heals were too weak, utility of cards not enough to be useful in party.

MCH low tier as dps, even now, tourel were useless until a previous patch.

DRK has interesting ideas but still lacks PLD or WAR raid utility, is still inferior to other 2 tanks in their own domains (MT or OT and even survivability) and is, arguably, bad designed (darkside, parry based tank)

I can't help but have the feeling SE was being lazy or too soft (amateurish?)making those jobs, as they literally underestimate all 3 in their own domain.
They are still trying to fix them, except DRK which has be given little work yet, but if they were designed better, we wouldn't have the feeling they screwed with their new jobs we waited for so long.

What do you guys think about it? What do you think about the new jobs anf them being patched/fixed every 2 weeks. Is it normal a new job from an expansion to be weaker? Isn't usually the other way around?
I want to hear your feedback, and your opinion, your deception if that's the case.

[Hieral]

Not much screwed up when DRK is the best magic tank, so useful for Alexander, competent MCHs are leading the DPS at over 1200 in Savage, and AST heals are now pretty much par with SCH and WHM as of 3 07, not to mention the tremendous boosts they get from cards...

Tell me again how these jobs fail? O.o

[AlphaSonic]

I'm going to talk about healers, but with those buffs I think AST is more viable and useful, BUT. With the new expansion, Healer classes are so homogenized that now every class is threateaned by other one. No class provides a niche that can be filled by another one. Burst heal? White Mage, Scholar and Astrologian can do it. Mitigation? Astrologian and Scholar. Regens. White Mage, Scholar and Astrologian. Buffs? Scholar and Astrologian

You might say, White Mage is better at burst healing and regens. Yes, it is. But by a margin.

Astrologian is better at buffs than Scholar. Yes, but Scholar selene doesn't require RNG and its 100% viable

Scholar is better at mitigation. Except when Adloquium crits, astrologian provides better shields.

Healer classes don't have any niche that can't be provided by another healer class and that's why there's a shitstorm right now in healer forums.

[AlphaFox]

I think people are still learning the jobs. Remember we had basically 2 years of playing with Paladin and Warrior. Cleric and Scholar. Now we have a new healer and tank, its going to take time for us to learn the rotations and optimal timing of everything. I have seen Darks do just fine and I would like to say I am a pretty good AST who has had minimal, if any, issues keeping my team alive.

[Wizarus]

Not much screwed up when DRK is the best magic tank, so useful for Alexander, competent MCHs are leading the DPS at over 1200 in Savage, and AST heals are now pretty much par with SCH and WHM as of 3 07, not to mention the tremendous boosts they get from cards...

Tell me again how these jobs fail? O.o

MCH leading what? Maybe in A2 or against trash, I don't see how it's touching DRG.

[Ashelia_Ferron]

All the jobs have had to be worked on, even when the game launched.

And after all that balancing, they had to add 3 more jobs and ensure that they were not overpowered and made the older jobs obsolete.

So they played it safe and decided to see what the community thought and then made tweaks accordingly.

Releasing a perfectly balanced class right from the start is near impossible so expecting that is pretty unreasonable

[Aeliott]

Better to be under-powered on launch than over-powered, like Ninja was.

[Daralii]

MCH leading what? Maybe in A2 or against trash, I don't see how it's touching DRG.

There are videos of them doing ~1100 on A1S, which is like 300 short of an optimal dragoon.

[Trixxy]

MCH leading what? Maybe in A2 or against trash, I don't see how it's touching DRG.

Are you seriously comparing a support dps like MCH to a DRG?
You know the difference between the two, right?
Support DPS like BRD's and MCH bring essential raid utility at the cost of high dps numbers while "proper" dps like DRG's, MNK's etc. top the dps charts, easily.
That doesn't mean a well played MCH can't easily beat a bad / sub-par DRG.

The new jobs have been buffed and are in no way inferior to others.

[loreleidiangelo]

I think people are still learning the jobs. Remember we had basically 2 years of playing with Paladin and Warrior. Cleric and Scholar. Now we have a new healer and tank, its going to take time for us to learn the rotations and optimal timing of everything. I have seen Darks do just fine and I would like to say I am a pretty good AST who has had minimal, if any, issues keeping my team alive.

There was no "learning curve" with AST; it was honestly a garbo-tier healer at it's release. Now that it's been buffed, it's competitive on the healing level, though most statics I've seen are still recruiting for WHM/SCH only on my server.