It's Time To Wake up

[Granyala]

I agree with the skill bloat. I mean seriously, why does BLM need 4 ice and 3 fire spells that all do the same?

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

I agree with the skill bloat. I mean seriously, why does BLM need 4 ice and 3 fire spells that all do the same?

They don't all do the same though. Fire 2 and Blizzard 2 are aoes. Fire 1 has a chance to make fire 3 free and instant. fire 4 does a ton of damage but only during enochian, and blizzard 4 extends enochians duration. fire 3 and blizzard 3 do a decent amount of damage, but their main purpose it to efficiently change between astral and umbral stacks for damage output and mp regen.

[Sacerdos]

Go too far fixing skill bloat and you end up with WoD Arms Warrior.

[Souljacker]

Skill bloating: I still don't see a whole lot of issues right now but considering my skillbar is almost filled with all sorts of skills (http://imgur.com/6Jy9VOw) I can see this becoming an issue in the next expansion.

Warrior is probably the best designed class right now. I agree that Warriors have it good. I recently started leveling my BLM and mapped out what my keybinds are going to look like at 60 and...

It isn't pretty. The number of rewriting macros I will be using I think is a little excessive (rewriting the bars at different parts of the rotation). I'm not against a bit of a challenge but with the way SE has designed this game, it feels like they just want to cater to those who play their keyboards at a concert pianist level and not at all anyone who is using a console\controller. To add insult to injury, we can't even *really* customize the UI. We get to move bars around but I want something like Bartender where you can take one bar and customize it by itself so it fits a numberpad pattern. Then you can have multiple bars mapped and scroll through them per situation.

In all, I agree with the OP. Hands down it's the most beautiful MMO out there. The nuts and bolts underneath still need some real, meaningful work done though and white knighting isn't doing anyone any favors. Not SE, not the players.

[Fendred]

@DreameR7g

Intellectual argument = debate. It does not refer to a fact with a truth value. You walked into a digital bar room brawl and decided to comment on how some of the angry slurs going back and forth constitute logical fallacies. Since trying to debate someone requires respect, that also means you'd want them to be at their best. No one here is at their best because we have too much heat in the room.

[DreameR7g]

Snip

Conceded on the definition of debate. However, it IS a fact you used a logical fallacy to try to prove yourself correct, as I just proved with the link.

As far as it being a bar room brawl, I don't see it as such. I see people getting heated because egos and pride being bruised, taking everything way too personal but its not much of a brawl.

I agree there is too much heat in the room, though. Sometimes, you need to just chill and let logic take over. Everybody is going to be passionate in what they believe to be true but belief falls in the way of an objective reality.

Edit @ Miscreant: There's always a point to debate with someone. I can tell Fendred is intelligent and so I decided to appeal to the logic within him rather than getting heated over opinion. Let's not get personal with this. There's no reason to other than trying to make yourself seem better than you actually are.

[Aeyis]

@DreameR7g

Intellectual argument = debate. It does not refer to a fact with a truth value. You walked into a digital bar room brawl and decided to comment on how some of the angry slurs going back and forth constitute logical fallacies. Since trying to debate someone requires respect, that also means you'd want them to be at their best. No one here is at their best because we have too much heat in the room.

Starting a debate on fallacies is amusing to begin with, truth be told. Personally I rarely care to write fallacy free, as I ''respond in kind''.



Intellectual argument =/ debate, by the way.
Atleast not as debating is defined in modern days.
Debaters typically only care about their (faction) argument winning, whereas in intellectual argument the concern is more about looking at something from multiple angles and defining said something in a way that takes these angles into account as much as possible.

Aka: in debate one side> other (one side has to be ''proven right'')
Whereas in intellectual argument: both sides work together and decide what is ''proven right''


Debating is really just about bullshitting, if you ask me. (<- former debater)

[Miscreant]

snip.

snip

There's no point arguing with this guy Dreamer, he's got one job that's 50 or above and it's kitted out with i145 gear...he's talking like he has expansive knowledge about this game and spouting nonsense, he hasn't done any of the end game and more than likely doesn't know how to push his own job to it's full potential, the type of guy I will out dps in my Ex Roulette even though I'm only a "healer" as he puts it.

Seriously It's like us arguing with a Conductor about music composition back when we were still in nappies listening to the Wheels on the Bus.

[Fendred]

@Miscreant. Except that isn't my first lvl 60 character. I think you can see my other characters on my profile if you click on my portrait or name. At least I think that is how it works.

Edit: Look under my character's tab. The other character is the one I played since release. This is just an alt I created due to the inventory system forcing me into playing a second character. Better than throwing out hours of grind work collecting vanity sets.

Also, Dream is acting in the capacity of a troll or forum bully. He jumped into an argument where I was defending myself from another poster's insinuations. If you just go back a few pages, you can see where it all started. Sophisticated terminology or not, he is using it like a club rather than its intended purpose.

[DreameR7g]

Snip

Uh huh.. sure I am. You can defend yourself all you'd like. However, when you try to defend yourself with illogical arguments, you are no better than the person you are defending yourself from.

And I can jump into a forum thread because you are in a public domain. If you feel abused by my words, I apologize. It is not my intention. However, just because you *feel* abused by me doesn't mean I am abusing you.