This is the end.

[Boosti]

So I have never had to post on the ffxiv forums before. In fact i just activated my account to post here and have been playing sense ARR launch. There is a huge problem with this community now. It is extremely toxic. I have a 60 ninja a 60 DRK and i just went back to finish up my bard. So i'm in a dungeon having a good time when all of the sudden im being crucified for having Mage's Bailed up. Being told thats it pointless to have up. Mind you i had it up for the sake of the healer maybe wanting to DPS a little. Every bit of DPS helps. So the other bard in my party is telling me i'm worthless and and i have no clue how a DRK knight plays and blah blah blah. See i have a DRK and i know that when you have Darkside up you don't get the effects of Mage's bailed, but what about when its off. Then Mage's bailed does work. So i tell the Bard maybe she should consider not telling people how to play there jobs. Please read Part 2.

[Boosti]

That was it nothing else was said by me. Then all hell broke loose i was told i'm a worthless retard and suck at the game and then was kicked out of the dungeon. Today will be the last time I get on this game, unless there is some saving grace that will fix this toxic community from the egotistical ass holes that consume it. I love Final Fantasy but this happens to much to make me enjoy a game that is no longer fun. If other have had this please let me know your story and how it has effected you.

[RiceisNice]

...

Ok, let me look at this from an outside perspective, because you're only giving us your side of the story.

So i'm in a dungeon having a good time when all of the sudden im being crucified for having Mage's Bailed up. Being told thats it pointless to have up. Mind you i had it up for the sake of the healer maybe wanting to DPS a little.

You're playing mage's ballad when it's not needed. Healers have their own ways of managing mana. In a typical dungeon run, they should never be running out anyway, and they certainly do not need ballad even if they're at 50% in a dungeon run. This also lowers your own damage. If you're playing it to no benefit (which is the case), you're lowering your damage for no payoff. In fact, you have a song that boosts magic damage without lowering your own damage.

See i have a DRK and i know that when you have Darkside up you don't get the effects of Mage's bailed, but what about when its off. Then Mage's bailed does work. So i tell the Bard maybe she should consider not telling people how to play there jobs.

Most DRKs don't turn off darkside if they can properly manage it. Turning it off and turning it on inbetween pulls has no net gain most of the time due to the cost of activation. And especially the bolded part. This is literally the worst thing for me to see in a DF party when people are purposely subperforming or otherwise slowing down their party.

That was it nothing else was said by me.

Combine that with above, I can see why some people can get upset with what you're doing (me included). You're giving off the impression that you're free to become a burden to your party. And unfortunately, at that point it's considered a player dispute since you responded, and most GMs would not touch this as far as contesting a vote kick. Because honestly, I'm sure the same would happen if a healer was healing in cleric stance, or a tank was having trouble/clinching onto the brink of death because they won't turn on their tanking stance. I'm fine with people genuinely do not know their class and listen to advice, I'm not fine with people that don't ever communicate and play terribly and essentially get carried.

unless there is some saving grace that will fix this toxic community from the egotistical ass holes that consume it.

Says the person that feels they can play how they want regardless of how it affects the party.

Now this may not be the case, but I'm giving an outside perspective that you and everyone else may not be considering.

[Miste]

Says the person that feels they can play how they want regardless of how it affects the party.

Well just going why what he said since we don't know both sides like you said but...he said they immediately attacked him over having ballad up calling him worthless etc. That is not the way to deal with things. You said "he feels he can play however he wants regardless of how it affects the party" but that is assuming he actually knows what is best and isn't doing optimal on purpose. He has no healers leveled so I am assuming he doesn't know that most healers don't need ballad in dungeons and they manage their own MP.

People in general have to start being more inquisitive instead of accusing. If someone is doing something not optimal you could just ask why and casually explain why they would be better off doing something else instead of not asking and just break out into "omg u r sooo stoopid for doing that, u so worthless". It IS possible the person just doesn't know or forgot.

That is not necessarily how things went down but I've had it happen to me. I leveled bard but I rarely play it so I forget things all the time. I've had both sides of people. Ones that ask me to use a song cause I am forgetting which I am glad they reminded me. Or the ones who yell at me "you $%$%#$#& suck bard" cause I am not doing what they want or what they think is best. All they had to do was ask me or let me know what would help them without resorting to raging.

Also lots of players are different. Some might want bards to do one thing during specific encounters while another would prefer you did something else. No one will ever know for sure what you want unless you ask first.

TL;DR - You can't just assume everyone else knows everything you do.

OP don't quit over this. It isn't worth it and you'll never see those players again likely.

[RiceisNice]

...

Attack him in what degree? People tend to hyperbole things in reaction to make it seem more than it really is. All we get was "I'm being crucified" It could've been a simple "why do you have ballad up" or "why the heck do you have ballad up". For all we know, it could've been the former. The problem is his reaction to it as well; Mind you, they even went further to why ballad was not needed and how it was hurting his dps, and most we got was.

So i tell the Bard maybe she should consider not telling people how to play there jobs. Please read Part 2.

And as a bard main, this is incredibly frustrating to me when you're trying to sing ballad to boost healer dps...when you specifically have another song that does just that without lowering your damage.

And yet, Ironically, you are not only doing the same thing, but you are also reinforcing the kind of nonsense that happens in dungeons as described by the OP.

Who are you to decide or judge whether another player is doing things the best way, or playing to their max. Even if they aren't who are you to tell them so? Is it your role to sit in judgement of others? Honestly, unless it's end-game or a raid, what does it matter? Offer constructive advice in a positive manner if you must. But critiquing someone's play is just asking for trouble.

I wish more people could realize that it's not their place to judge, and they are not the be all and end all of what constitutes a high playing standard.

I'm not reinforcing or even encouraging people to wrongfully kick or harass people that are (un)intentionally playing inefficently. Infact, I didn't even mention the former. The thing is, we have such a limited perspective but everyone seems convinced otherwise that there is nothing at fault with OP, or if he was even wrongfully kicked at all.

The fact he stopped talking and eventually got kicked leads me to believe that he did not pay any attention to the party or their suggestion (solicited or not) and still kept ballad up anyway throughout the fight.

My point is, everyone should have at least some degree of performance in a party. I'm not even asking for savage-tier dps, but to grasp a basic understanding of your class and abilties. If they don't, then people are either going to point it out, and what you do with that regardless of how it's presented is up to you. You could keep that healer in your party who just refuses to turn off cleric stance and still doesn't contribute to any dps, or vote kick them because it's becoming a burden to the party. You could have a warrior tank that repeatedly dies to every trash pull because he can't stay alive in deliverance.

[Miste]

Attack him in what degree? People tend to hyperbole things in reaction to make it seem more than it really is. All we get was "I'm being crucified" It could've been a simple "why do you have ballad up" or "why the heck do you have ballad up". For all we know, it could've been the former. The problem is his reaction to it as well; Mind you, they even went further to why ballad was not needed and how it was hurting his dps, and most we got was.


And as a bard main, this is incredibly frustrating to me when you're trying to sing ballad to boost healer dps...when you specifically have another song that does just that without lowering your damage.

Like I said in my post I didn't say that is definitely how things went down. All I was pointing out was another possibility and that you really can't just assume someone is doing this "play how they want regardless of how it affects the party." Just because you know that Foe is better than Ballad for helping healers DPS doesn't mean everyone does. Also its possible some people don't share your opinion even though it is based in good fact.

Just reminding that people have to remember not everyone knows everything about this game or how things work. People will never know what others want unless they let them know. Also helping others by letting them know what is good goes way farther than yelling at them, name calling, shaming, kicking them out of groups etc.

Considering how defensive OP is getting even in his own topic likely he was not innocent and fueled the dispute in which he got kicked though. But my posts are more in general and the fact it does happen that players just immediately rage instead of talking to the other player calmly first and ask questions or make suggestions.

[Boosti]

to RiceisNice

I turned bailed off when they first got on me about it. And its people like you that expect way to much out of people. Im 100% sure that your one of those asshole players that would have kicked somebody for no reason other then being a self centered egotistical toxic human and expect perfection out of everybody. Hate to tell you the truth but not everybody is perfect like you.

[Kosmos992k]

Says the person that feels they can play how they want regardless of how it affects the party.

And yet, Ironically, you are not only doing the same thing, but you are also reinforcing the kind of nonsense that happens in dungeons as described by the OP.

Who are you to decide or judge whether another player is doing things the best way, or playing to their max. Even if they aren't who are you to tell them so? Is it your role to sit in judgement of others? Honestly, unless it's end-game or a raid, what does it matter? Offer constructive advice in a positive manner if you must. But critiquing someone's play is just asking for trouble.

I wish more people could realize that it's not their place to judge, and they are not the be all and end all of what constitutes a high playing standard.

[Adire]

Who are you to decide or judge whether another player is doing things the best way, or playing to their max. Even if they aren't who are you to tell them so?

Playing a ballad that lowers your dps when the healer isn't even aching for MP for their dps is not doing things the best way. That's just all there is to it really.

And when someone is knowingly causing problems for the group and continuing to do so, refusing not to, people have a right to speak up though it should be done civilly. There are 3 other people in the group, one person causing the others issues and being unmoving is grounds for the three people to voice concerns.

Judging by the OP going on for a bit without saying anything, but drama being brought up anew, it sounds like he was continuing to play ballad even after the others making it clear they didn't want him to. And it wasn't benefiting the group.

[Elazu]

Snip

This right here.