Artificial Difficulty

[seorin]

imo, artificial difficulty is when player ability has little to no influence on the task, but it's still "difficult". In most cases, this is RNG, such as getting a Terra Branford card. It can also be something that's pointlessly grindy, like getting a fenrir mount (or mobs with too much hp). These things don't require any special player ability other than hitting your head against a wall until done. Sadly, this describes the vast majority of the non-combat parts of the game. :/

[Fenwick]

Based on the original post, this is how I would describe what is listed.

• DPS checks aka performing perfect rotations (Difficulty)
• RNG (Need to be more specific, random boss rotations are difficulty)
• Twitch Mechanics (It depends)
• Scripted mechanics aka memorization (Difficulty, but not preferred)
• Team jump rope aka finding 8 people who know the fight (Neither, this is just proper preparation)
• Content gates or lockouts (Neither, just a restriction)

Things I am against, overuse (not all) of one shot mechanics. RNG that makes something impossible based on uncontrolled circumstances, haven't seen too much of this in this game thankfully. Memorization can be tedious, I prefer mechanics that are based more so on adaptability.

[Allyrion]

Case in point, all of it is artificial, it's just when people say something feels artificial they really mean that it feels unfair, cheap, or only difficult in a specific way to waste time. Anything that is a heavy "damage" check can be a time waster so a lot of people put that as being artificial difficulty, for example.

For myself, things feel artificial when the mechanics are brain dead simple and the only thing the group is struggling with is running numbers. That is why I hate enrage timers, instant kill after a certain amount of time, etc. If a group takes longer to kill something they shouldn't get punished for it. The point is to learn the pattern and survive it.

I get that it's personal, but calling it artificial is acting like it's some legitimate category.
Which it isn't if it's personal and different for everyone.

DPS checks are based on mechanics though.
They're based on Job mechanics and how to synergize with your comp.
Numbers aren't just passive, at least not in this game.

Unless it's proven that it's virtually impossible for anyone to do it until passive stat upgrades, then it's artificial.
But hasn't ever been the case.

Not having enrage timers allows for teams to turtle and play it safe the whole fight.
Sometimes leading to silly things like bringing a ton of healers so that once everyone does the fight's gimmick mechanics, you can pass without any fear of dying.
Worse, it trivializes all the optimization and Job mechanics you're supposed to learn.

What's the point of all our skills if we just have to jump through some loops at the right time to win a fight?
You should be good at your Job, and DPS checks are how you test the dps.
Boss damage output is how you test the tanks and healers.

While fight mechanics are important and all, they have little to do with how good a person is at their Job.
If mastering your Job is irrelevant to clearing content, Jobs are pointless.

They have all these mechanics involved and developed to maximize dps, why shouldn't your dps matter other than making the fight shorter?
If you can do that, you're ignoring the most basic mechanics - your Job's.
Enrage timers force dps to do mechanics and master their Job's damage output at the same time.
Boss damage force tanks to do fight mechanics while master their hate and mitigation.
Damage on Tank as well as on other players (and debuffs) test the healers while they do fight mechanics.

Not having enrage timers just let dps slack off or not even needed.
Numbers - healing, mitigation, damage - are all still mostly based on mechanics more than gear.

imo, artificial difficulty is when player ability has little to no influence on the task, but it's still "difficult". In most cases, this is RNG, such as getting a Terra Branford card. It can also be something that's pointlessly grindy, like getting a fenrir mount (or mobs with too much hp). These things don't require any special player ability other than hitting your head against a wall until done. Sadly, this describes the vast majority of the non-combat parts of the game. :/

I agree.
RNG can be a pretty bad gating (like the relic quest sometimes).
It's just worse when you can be really unlucky or really lucky and get an easy run or get that item you need on the first try.

I think good RNG stays within a certain range.
Kind of like the gearing system where you can trade in items for gear.
With Ravana as an example, you're guaranteed a weapon after 10 clears.

While fight mechanic RNG can't be like that, it's okay once it doesn't make or break the fight.
(I.e. one run is cake cause the rng lines up really well while another feels impossible).

RNG needs to still stay within a range so that it's not unfair.

[Yukiko]

well... in general its easy to programm a good system.

You have on one side the input (how many players, which level, which class, and so on...)
Based on that input data you can calculate the outcome with formulas (more life, other mechanics, and so on...)
Then on the other side we have a nice dynamic and challenging encounter where players can choose the difficult by changing "input"...

4 man too hard? go in with 5
cant get a second tank? boss will not do the tankswap mechanics
and so on...

RNG does not make static programming into a dynamic!
Players ask for more dynamic? oh, then just lets add RNG on top of RNG... thats the wrong direction!
The problem we have is in the core code: I do not think the game is collecting enough input to calculate the output because its easier to have a static programming with less data to handle.

Edit: For the example with tankswap: Sometimes removing a mechanic will result to make it too easy, thats why you can replace it with another mechanic for solotanks, you get the idea? It was just an example anyway, there the job for the balancing team begins!

Edit2: The more input you have, the better the output gets!

[Mikedizzy]

Artificial difficulty to me is locking content behind gear, even if you have the skill to be it...that is crap.

[Krylo]

I get that it's personal, but calling it artificial is acting like it's some legitimate category.
Which it isn't if it's personal and different for everyone.

Just because people (mis)use the term in ridiculous ways that doesn't mean it doesn't exist and have a meaning, or that it's purely subjective. It's another word for 'bad' difficulty or 'punishing' vs 'challenging'.

Basically games are designed with specific mechanics and gameplay cycles involved. In FFXIV DPS checks are one of them, as is dodging AoEs, 'team jump rope', and otherwise executing manuevers. These are all designed/challenging/good difficulty. They're there for a reason, and are all keyed very specifically. FFXIV has very very little artificial difficulty. I'd suggest there's some in RNG issues with farming things and crafting, but that's there to be a time sink. Arguably, there's also the increase in open world mob difficulty in HW (but those mobs are so easy anyway, that it's hardly worth mentioning).

Artificial/bad/punishing difficulty is the opposite of designed difficulty. The most common place it happens is when enemy parameters are tuned up (damage, hp, etc) but nothing is altered in their actual mechanics. Imagine if T9 savage mode had all the mechanics exactly the same, but Nael had 5x the HP and did 3x as much damage, as opposed to adding extra meteors during heavensfall, and divebombs and adding an extra thunder and just generally adding more mechanics. That's artificial difficulty. It's no longer tuned to allow people to learn the fight, or increase their skill. Indeed, as you have to have done T9 normal to do savage, it's no longer skill at all that prevails, just endurance.

It's most often seen in difficulty increases in other games (go into Very Hard and instead of AI or mechanics changing things just hit you harder and absorb more bullets).

Or when things aren't telegraphed at all--which is to say something happens you have no method of reacting to until it's happened. All your choices need to be informed; if you're just shooting in the dark that's artificial difficulty. You need some kind of hint that something dangerous is going to happen, or, at least, time to react when it does. You need a way to play around things (the ground AoE markers in FFXIV are a great way of ensuring this doesn't happen here, or at least very very rarely). Lacking these is the equivalent of 'rocks fall, everybody dies, no saving throw.'

There's also things like bad camera controls (most early 3D games, most noticable in platformers--how many times did you miss a jump in Mario 3D, not because you were incapable, but because the Camera refused to stay lined up right?), or buggy, glitchy things. Or situations where the rules in the game change without warning or consistency (this kind of leads back to telegraphing, if the rules are consistent they telegraph themselves--such as being able to look away to dodge gaze attacks in FFXIV). And, of course, iteration time. Long iteration time--which is to say you die and go back 30 minutes of gameplay--is punishing, not challenging or fun. Again, FFXIV avoids this pretty well with instant and cheap teleports--although I'd say it could be improved by having you rez at the nearest aetheryte to your death instead of your home point, but no one's perfect.

ANYWAY, the point of all this is that, no it's not entirely subjective. It's part of game design and important for design philosophy to understand and identify the difference between artificial/designed or good/bad or challenging/punishing or whatever two adjectives you want to use for difficult.

[Khalithar]

• DPS checks aka performing perfect rotations
• RNG
• Twitch Mechanics
• Scripted mechanics aka memorization
• Team jump rope aka finding 8 people who know the fight
• Content gates or lockouts

DPS checks- They test whether someone actually knows their rotation or just button mashes. It's also done as a way to prevent people from overpowering content with extra healers to trivialize mechanics.

RNG- I wouldn't call RNG artificial difficulty, I will call it frustrating though. Cheap deaths where there was nothing you could do are lame. I've yet to see this in XIV though, a death where there was absolutely nothing you could have done to prevent it through better play or preparation. TERA actually did the best by largely taking RNG out of it's combat, every monster has a distinct behavior with patterns, tells, and things to watch out for. Every death in that game is legitimately your fault as pretty much every attack in that game can be avoided if you are good enough. It really empowers the player and puts control of whether you live or die in your hands.

Twitch mechanics- Feel more like a test of latency than anything else.

Memorization- That's really all raiding comes down to, scripted mechanics where you know what to expect. XIV actually moves away from this slightly as there are scripted mechanics but you can never know who it will target. Not always the case though, I am reminded of the Ravana phase where he always targets the other tank unless that tank is dead.

Getting people- That's always been part of the raiding challenge.

Content gates- Not difficult, but it can be frustrating. The worst part about content gating though is player attrition. When you have to beat one thing to get to the good stuff, what happens when a good player leaves or quits the game? Either you have to hope to find someone that's completed the first step or you have to go back and re-clear content you don't need to get a person in to the content where you do need them. Then players burn out and the cycle perpetuates itself.

[Allyrion]

Just because people (mis)use the term in ridiculous ways that doesn't mean it doesn't exist and have a meaning, or that it's purely subjective. It's another word for 'bad' difficulty or 'punishing' vs 'challenging'.

I'm contradicting it because there is an objective way to use the term.
It's just misused.

Even you are conflating punishing difficulty with artificial difficulty, and even bad difficulty (which is obviously the most subjective category).
Those are all different type if you look at them objectively.
Grouping together different terminology in some general negative category, lends to the same subjective misuse of the term.

Your biggest example is not artificial difficulty.
Tuned up parameters still take the personal performance mechanics into account, where the difficulty comes from the mechanics of your character/group rather than the boss.
That is objectively designed difficulty unless it's completely gear-gated which is almost never the case.

Once the potential to clear is within the player(s), then it's not artificial.
Tuning things tightly might be Punishing difficulty, just like stuff like Titan extreme as well (with twitch mechanics).
But it's not Artificial.

Things outside of your control are Artificial difficulty.
Like RNG, which can test adaptability in some cases but can be considered artificial when you had a more difficult run because RNG wasn't on your side.
Or when it's used to gate rewards, so it's not about earning but you wait for the system to randomly be nice to you.
Gating in general is artificial. Such as weekly lockouts.
The system restricts your growth to sustain tuning difficulty.

But the tuning itself is not artificial.
Increasing numbers instead of specific fight mechanics, just means you have to work with your own personal Jobs' mechanics.
But that should be expected.
Just because they gave you damage mechanics to work with when you started the game/levelled up (personal abilities and traits) instead of when you entered the instance (Dive-bombs, meteors, etc.) doesn't make it less valid.
Ideally the game should be testing your ability to juggle fight mechanics while also doing your personal skills extremely optimally.

The main error in assumption (while true in some other games) is when people believe that number tuning isn't based with the players abilities/resources in mind.
At least in this game, it obviously is. They don't just up numbers and HP without taking into account what Jobs are able to achieve with how their Job mechanics work..

Hence tight tuning is still usually still designed with the player's control to clear.
It is designed difficulty as well, because you have rotations that are designed to be optimized.
That's the whole point of your skill set, to use it in the fight.

Like I said above, things should be tuned to test your optimization instead of just how well you can jump through the fight specific hoops.
All your Job mechanics are meant to be part of the difficulty of mastering your Job, and how well you've mastered your Job should be relevant to the clearing content (not just the fight gimmicks).
That is in your control. It is not artificial.

Bad camera controls, RNG, system gating, these are things that are really outside your control.
These are artificial.
Some, like the gating and some level of RNG, are acceptable forms of artificial difficulty.
They are still designed difficulty, but it's not designed with the player being relevant at all.
The difficulty is there no matter how good you are because the system decides everything, hence it's completely artificial.

If we're being objective, it's not about good or bad.
So grouping up everything negative is making the term itself meaningless.

There can be good and bad artificial difficulty, or good and bad punishing difficulty.
When you're talking about good or bad though, then you're talking about subjectively.
The categories themselves can be a priori, while people are free to judge what they like or don't like within each category.

[Scruffyx]

[*]Scripted mechanics aka memorization
[*]Team jump rope aka finding 8 people who know the fight

These are the ones I mean when I talk about "artificial difficulty". If you can put on a blindfold and still clear the content, that's not the difficulty I personally want. Adding a bit more RNG forcing one to react to situations is more of the difficulty I'd like to see.

[Whiteroom]

I wouldn't say any of the ones you listed are Artificial Difficulty. Its more like giving something a ridiclous amount of hp, or way more damage than can possibly be handled. Also on top of the hp, giving it something like bene. HP just serves to drag the fight out, giving people more chances to mess up, it does nothing to make the fight more difficult in a meaninful way. The too much damage for any relevant gear is pretty self explainitory.

I guess the rng could be considered artificial if it is just random one shots all the time.


A prime example would be open world mobs in HW, the just gave them way more hp and damage, with no benefit to killing them, not even a hunt log.