Job Personalization: Can I Have It?

[Kallera]

And I didn't suggest that. I was directly responding to the passive/agressive post that was insulting players who acknowledge the glaring problems of specializations/customization.

Whenever someone makes a suggestion they more often than not have the tendency to pretend that everything will just be roses. What you want will bring about some obvious problems and it's perfectly reasonable for other players to oppose them.

Reasonable!? Then why the hell am i pidgeonholed behind stat caps and endless waves of token gear? Why does crafting get less enjoyable time and again?!

I played a rdm in xi, i switched to thf and dnc, i played with various builds, even if i didn't have the rarest of gear, and i left not because of the job system.

I simply agreed with the op. I don't believe the game is perfect, haven't since the beta.
And it isn't insanity to think this shouldn't be all that the game ever is.

[otarolgam]

In with "PS3 Limitations".

As long as me and people like me are around, there won't be massive changes, guys. We PS3 players are holding things back.

Just sit back, relax and wait another year before the next expansion gets announced/released.

[Gilthas]

Reasonable!? Then why the hell am i pidgeonholed behind stat caps and endless waves of token gear? Why does crafting get less enjoyable time and again?!

Apples and oranges.

I hate what they have done to gathering and crafting, but that has nothing to do with adding stat/ability customization to FFXIV.

I played FFXI for 4 years. And I also didn't leave because of the job system. In addition, FFXI's balance problems also really didn't have much to do with the merit system, because the "options" we had there were mostly irrelevant.

My posts have been specifically directed against posters claiming that balance only matters to raiders, which is a blatant lie. FFXIV doesn't have perfect balance at the moment, but its leagues ahead of anything that FFXI ever had. The system people are advocating for here will either be irrelevant (and basically not what they want) or make the game that much harder to balance. I'd rather see SE adding new jobs to the game.

And it isn't insanity to think this shouldn't be all that the game ever is.

And it also isn't insanity for people to not like the stuff you want. Stop pretending that it is.

[Kallera]

Apples and oranges.

I hate what they have done to gathering and crafting, but that has nothing to do with adding stat/ability customization to FFXIV.

I played FFXI for 4 years. And I also didn't leave because of the job system. In addition, FFXI's balance problems also really didn't have much to do with the merit system, because the "options" we had there were mostly irrelevant.

My posts have been specifically directed against posters claiming that balance only matters to raiders, which is a blatant lie. FFXIV doesn't have perfect balance at the moment, but its leagues ahead of anything that FFXI ever had.

It has everything to do with it! Can't have anything interfering with the ilvl.

And it also isn't insanity for people to not like the stuff you want. Stop pretending that it is.

Take your own advice about your opposition. I'm done feeling grateful to merely play the game.

[Gilthas]

It has everything to do with it! Can't have anything interfering with the ilvl.

No it doesn't.

As far as I'm concerned, as long as gathering and crafting continue to be one huge gilgrind they should be kept as far away from gear progression as possible. When players can gather/craft their own gear with a reasonable amount of effort, then crafting can be relevant to gear progression.

Take your own advice about your opposition. I'm done pretending nothing is wrong.

By all means, complain about the stuff you don't like. Just be prepared to accept that others will disagree with you.

[Intaki]

Skill trees and the like just don't work. The only choices they actually give you are the optimal choice and the choices equivalent to a DRG that insists upon using Feint and Fracture in their rotation.

[Dhex]

Skill trees and the like just don't work. The only choices they actually give you are the optimal choice and the choices equivalent to a DRG that insists upon using Feint and Fracture in their rotation.

Considering the game gives you no true choices at this point I fail to see how this line of thinking holds up.

[Rafaelhades]

For the sake of discussion, let's explore possibilities then. Let's pick Ninja, since it has a lot of potential for dual paths: melee focus and spell focus. Let's imagine NIN getting the option to spec into either a physical DPS or a Ninjutsu-based magical DPS. How would you balance this, knowing it now competes with DRG and MNK for physical DPS and BLM and SMN for magical AND all 4 for a DPS slot? Do you balance it to be even with all 4? Or do you overpower it compared to 1 side of the DPS coin or the other? XI had this option. You could spend millions to try to make NIN nukers. Hell, I did. Innin was a stance that increased Ninjutsu dmg and you can sub /BLM for the Magic attack boost or RDM for fastcast for rapid fire spell casting. Was it fun? Yes. Was it feasable for any content outside of solo? Hell no. With the way haste worked, just autoattacking dealt far more dmg than spell casting. And building for solo has no impact on anything whatsoever.

If it deals similar dmg to a BLM, the BLM complains that the NIN deals similar dmg yet has no cast times. Same with SMN. On the melee front, should a NIN deal dmg on par with a DRG? What if the community discovers that Mage Ninja deals more dmg in the long run compare to Melee Ninja due to relative safety and not having to worry about positionals/range? Do all NINs get forced into one spec or the other or should all DPS deal equal dmg all the time? Isn't that the problem we're facing now? Expand that to all of the jobs and you have a developer headache on your hands. We have every job complaining that they can't perform on equal grounds with other jobs already (DPS forums are really bad with this), and you want to create diversity where one spec will undoubtedly claw it's way to the top? And if one doesn't and everything is "balanced," isn't that just homogenization? Unless they create content where the battle always changes. But at that point, players will just figure out the pattern and exit the battle until their desired conditions are met (think Grift fishing in D3).

Hardcore or not, EVERYONE will want the best, regardless of content difficulty. In fact, I suspect the whole job personalization idea stems from the desire to have one's ideal spec be "raid" viable, if not, the best spec for the class. Because, in an ironic twist, people want others to join them in playing their favorite play style.

If it's for non-raid content, do whatever you want, as long as you're capable of doing said content. I can ask some friends to run dungeons with me on Archer, use my Hive Bow + Law/Alex gear and do just as well as on my BRD with the same gear. I can do Primals on MRD with Law Axe as either DPS or tank or both. The game isn't hard and you don't need optimal setups to do any outside of Savage. It requires a player to know how to play. Asking for specializations just screams "make X build raid viable please SE" to me.

[Intaki]

Considering the game gives you no true choices at this point I fail to see how this line of thinking holds up.

The game absolutely does give you true choices. Any DRG who wants to can integrate Feint and Fracture into their DPS rotations.

And yet, no one does.

[Izsha]

The game absolutely does give you true choices. Any DRG who wants to can integrate Feint and Fracture into their DPS rotations.

And yet, no one does.

Exactly. Everyone already forgot about classes. You can get provoke physic and blizzard 2 on your lancer. You want to tank spec lancer? Have at it. Oh you don't want to? Why is that exactly? Because it's not as strong as dragoon and groups would kick you unless they were your personal friends. Yet this is customization and it's already washed out. Sure they could make them stronger. But I'm the end theu won't be equal. One spec or build will be stronger or synergies better with the party and become the standard. It's not better for drgs if they spec lancer tank build to be stronger than a war. It just kills off wars. There is no balance because there is always a winner and a looser. That's the illusion of choice. You can choose the winner or the looser, but never 2 winners.