PLD dps needs to be buffed, current dps a joke

[Faytte]

PLD can do plenty of damage, you just need to know when it's safe to swap to Sword Oath and be able to properly rotate your CDs so that you're not turning into an MP sponge.

By plenty, you mean the least out of all three tanks while outside of their defensive stance, and loads less while in their defensive stance? Costs a gcd to swap into either stance, takes a fifth of your mana (problematic in AS2 where you actually want mana for things like flash) and once in it--yeah its not terribly impressive. It's ---better--- certainly, but to say they do plenty of damage begs the question of some data and what you consider loads. If they actually mitigated most of the Alexander content better than other tanks (they dont) I'd feel more comfortable with them, or if their enmity allowed for offensive tanking (I tank 80% of Faust for instance in deliverance and can alternate debuffs, not -needing- to use my aggro combo very often at all. On my equal ilvl paladin? You better believe im spamming rage of halone--which kind of makes Royal Authority a tad useless.

[Zdenka]

Since people are talking about PLD DPS here :O

We just beat Alex 3 savage today, we used MNK/PLD instead of DRG/DRK like the other clear groups were running.

My PLD DPS at the end of the fight was 650.33, next week the DPS I have to do will go down since everyone will have weapons.

PLD isn't too far behind DRK at all, its just that DRG buffs BRD so you have a large net gain swapping those roles around. PLD needs to get piercing debuff added to RA is the correct buff to the class!

[Faytte]

Since people are talking about PLD DPS here :O

We just beat Alex 3 savage today, we used MNK/PLD instead of DRG/DRK like the other clear groups were running.

My PLD DPS at the end of the fight was 650.33, next week the DPS I have to do will go down since everyone will have weapons.

PLD isn't too far behind DRK at all, its just that DRG buffs BRD so you have a large net gain swapping those roles around. PLD needs to get piercing debuff added to RA is the correct buff to the class!

Would love to see an actual meter to this. No offense, lots of people claim numbers but without seeing a meter--its all just air.

[Zdenka]

Would love to see an actual meter to this. No offense, lots of people claim numbers but without seeing a meter--its all just air.

I blanked out all other people in the kill and just left in just PLD, can see on the left the ACT parse has a different color for this attempt indicating a kill. errrr well it would be if i didnt have it selected

http://imgur.com/u6kyopY

[Faytte]

I blanked out all other people in the kill and just left in just PLD, can see on the left the ACT parse has a different color for this attempt indicating a kill. errrr well it would be if i didnt have it selected

http://imgur.com/u6kyopY

Well you delivered! Your damage taken looks pretty low--were you the OT for most of the fight (for when there is such a thing as OT/MT--I know a lot of it is duo tanking, but not all of it).

EDIT: Looks like the war is above you. Can you unblock out that line, minus their name. Curious to look at the difference. Although--to repeat it, rarely do I see anyone call out and then get delivered facts. I'm humbled ^_^

[Zdenka]

Well you delivered! Your damage taken looks pretty low--were you the OT for most of the fight (for when there is such a thing as OT/MT--I know a lot of it is duo tanking, but not all of it).

EDIT: Looks like the war is above you. Can you unblock out that line, minus their name. Curious to look at the difference.

I was MT entire first phase, and then like normal(most people?) I was MT for 3 of 6 Cascade sections. Right now I just wanted to post this to let people know what PLD can do, if I had been OT at the start of the fight I'd be over 700 DPS on the fight most likely. I also stop DPSing the adds to make sure I have 1000 TP entering Cascade sections, since PLD TP is terribad. So I lost a little DPS from that also.

[Faytte]

I was MT entire first phase, and then like normal(most people?) I was MT for 3 of 6 Cascade sections. Right now I just wanted to post this to let people know what PLD can do, if I had been OT at the start of the fight I'd be over 700 DPS on the fight most likely. I also stop DPSing the adds to make sure I have 1000 TP entering Cascade sections, since PLD TP is terribad. So I lost a little DPS from that also.

I started this xpac as a paladin but I've felt far more comftorable (damage, and frankly mitigation wise) on my warrior and opted to swap back. A1S just seemed to go smoother with it, but we are still there at the time being. It's good to see where your damage is with melded accessories (which I suppose anyone that is serious should have--I'm still gathering all my mats for the meldathon/cryathon).

Would love to see a tank pov from you on as1/as2/as3 some day--my general impression so far of paladin has been.
1) spamming rage a bit more than id like, especially when in sword oath.
2) divine veil is nice, but never really a game changer. Clemency is generally too slow to be effective as an mt, and so so as an ot. AS3 is a place sheltron feels more useful but looking at AS2 and going through as1--not as much? I don't know how you do as1 without having to hallowed ground the second buster for instance--but maybe you just count on that as a Paladin as a defensive cd as opposed to an 'oh crap' or mechanic specific cd like holmgang and living dead.

[Zdenka]

I only have DRK and PLD at 60 but from what I can tell right now,

PLD feels more comfortable to play, that's why I use it instead of DRK. Yes maybe I can do more damage on DRK, but I tunnel hard on DRK since I'm not used to it.

PLD's main drawbacks are right now, is that it's new combo's are great but don't add threat so you either need a Ninja or a ton of STR gear, or both. If you try to hold threat in Sword Oath now, you basically just have to spam Halone combo for the bonus threats and give up on that extra DPS. Depends how good your DPS/OT are and how much your healer has to heal, so it could vary. Basically PLD does less threat (comparatively) than it does in 2.0.

The other things are:

With high DPS checks, stoneskin and clemency are basically useless, you probably lose 3-4 encounter DPS for every cast. Divine Veil is good, its really good actually, if it wasn't on a 3 minute CD.

Shelltron :X yeahhhhh good and bad at same time

[Faytte]

Shelltron :X yeahhhhh good and bad at same time

Basically, its fantastic but nothing actually capitilizes on it. Rav Ex; you could time it with every blinding blade. Amazing!
Since then? Um...Auto attacks? Not really that impressive. In fact, cause of it I imagine kite shields are really a better choice over tower shields for total mitigation.

I actually kind of hate the route they went with physical and magic damage in Heavensward. It feels that, fight to fight, either Dark or Paladin will be (mitigation wise) loads better, while Warrior casually shrugs and tanks both 'good enough'.

[Phoenicia]

Basically, its fantastic but nothing actually capitilizes on it. Rav Ex; you could time it with every blinding blade. Amazing!
Since then? Um...Auto attacks? Not really that impressive. In fact, cause of it I imagine kite shields are really a better choice over tower shields for total mitigation.

I actually kind of hate the route they went with physical and magic damage in Heavensward. It feels that, fight to fight, either Dark or Paladin will be (mitigation wise) loads better, while Warrior casually shrugs and tanks both 'good enough'.

In a magical damage fight, WAR has every disadvantage the PLD has minus the DPS. WAR loses on parry and Raw Intuition (can still use it for wrath/abandon I guess?) just like how PLD loses shield and Bulwark/Sheltron.

My point is WAR isn't far ahead (if at all) of PLD in non-physical fights. Effective HP wise WAR can pull 7% more EHP than PLD but is still 4~10% Effective healing behind due to discrepancy in the healing bonus from Defiance and it not affecting healing abilities. A MT WAR "can" mitigate more than PLD in both physical and magical environments but it will ALWAYS be easier and safer to heal a PLD MT.

DRK is the odd one in that it mitigates magical damage a lot better than the other tanks (very short but effective CD against magical damage) but at the same time is the worst physical tank because it lacks to tools to handle it outside of 2 major relatively long CDs.

Do not get me wrong, PLD needs a buff on its basic enmity combo multiplier to be in line with the other tanks. It is sad that PLD FINALLY got an actual rotation, but still end up only spamming 1, 2, 3 to barely keep enmity.