PLD dps needs to be buffed, current dps a joke

[Dhex]

Actually it's the inability to hold hate off the increased DPS that DPS puts out while in SWo, while DRK and WAR can hold hate outside of their tank stance. Hate generation needs to be heighten considerably which in turn would allow for us to spam RA more. Having to be in Shield Oath and consistently using RoH instead of RA cuts damage back by a good chunk. Increase in general damage however wouldn't be so bad.

Personally I have no issues holding hate with Sword Oath. If you lose hate on pull start with a Shield Oath thru. at least one Rage of Halone combo then swap over and go all out. If you're using Royal Authority exclusively while trying to MT in Sword Oath you're not going to be able to keep control - every third or fourth combo toss Rage of Halone. I use STR & Sword Oath for Alexander Normal (1-3), Bismark EX, and for large portions of Ravana EX. Obviously Sword Oath is not really going to be useful in Savage until people get higher gear that allows for it.

Overall my view point is this - Paladin needs a boost of ~7% actual flat output on it's DPS - giving Sword a 5% boost seems fair to me & adding a modifier or status buff to the DPS combo would at least make it competitive damage wise.

[Synestra]

Clemency specifically can be problematic in practice.

I think PLD dps is pretty good atm but it is the utility that needs some minor tweaks, Clemency is awesome but the cast-time is killer as you will get out-casted by healers 99% of time. 1.5-2s cast-time for Clemency would be ideal so your heals wont get wasted and you could get yourself up faster after tankbusters. Also Divine Veil needs something as atm its CD that you have no control over it and its totally up to healers to proc it and if they miss its GG.

[rawker]

I'd rather let the WARs take the burst glory. Sword Oath is fine. Just give us more swords with even faster aa delay to compensate our no extra damage from maim and darkside.

[Twilite]

I remember a time long ago, probably before the person above me was even born, where a tank was a tank, it didn't matter what it "brings". Just there to soak up damage while others create it and not get killed in the process.

[Ditto]

I remember a time long ago, probably before the person above me was even born, where a tank was a tank, it didn't matter what it "brings". Just there to soak up damage while others create it and not get killed in the process.

Hiding insults only shows you're not as old as you're claiming to be. Whether mentally or physically.

Might want to hop off the "I remember" nostalgia and get with the times. Tanks are more than meat shields who just sit there to soak hits now.

[HoodRat]

I remember a time long ago, probably before the person above me was even born, where a tank was a tank, it didn't matter what it "brings". Just there to soak up damage while others create it and not get killed in the process.

You must be the only one. Dps and healers I see don't seem to be of the same opinion.

[SirTaint]

Lucerzia just announced their MT had to do 650 DPS to clear A3S. OT did 800.

That's a lot of SwOing for a PLD but doable with good healers.

[Ditto]

Lucerzia just announced their MT had to do 650 DPS to clear A3S. OT did 800.

That's a lot of SwOing for a PLD but doable with good healers.

By now it should be a bit easier, seeing as Paladins can get their Esoteric weapon already.

They're still better suited as the OT however, in place of a good War MT until gear progresses a little more. You'll get the most out of both positions up until the last phase, where both tanks will be on and off with holding the boss.

[Xenosan]

I don't think DPS is the only thing, it's just 1 variable in the metric. I think the frustration though has to do with combat meta - which devalues PLD currently and empowers DRK due to magic tank busters (but could easily become a shoe-on-the-other-foot scenario in future content), & a reliance on slashing debuff via WAR or NIN - since PLD strength is suppose to be better mitigation for more Healer DPS - this concept doesn't work.


The Magic Tanker VS Physical Tanker dynamic has me a little worried. DRK should have an advantage with magical, PLD with advantage with Physical, but those trade-offs IMO shouldn't be too drastic. (should be just 1 cd like like so: Dark Mind VS permanent shield + Bulwark). Meanwhile WAR is over here IBing & SPathing everything not giving 2 fucks. Also Int Down VS Str Down VS SPath seems like another paradigm empowering this dynamic. The analogy I'd use for all this would be:

A Dark Knight, a Warrior, and a Paladin sit at a table with a jar of cookies.

The Dark Knight takes a cookie from the jar.

The Warrior takes the jar,

then tells the Paladin, "The DRK is eating yours."

--
I'd like to see PLD have INT Down instead of DRK. That way mainStat reduction debuffs are their 'thing.' DRK gets Rend Mind & Rend Weapon equivalents via Power Slash & Delirium. WAR still has SPath - which is the best of the bunch, and more easily administered and upkept. But at least with this route any tank duo can stack mitigation debuffs thus making viable MT/OT compositions.

Sorry for the derail. but IMO filling these gaps in mitigation debuffs for OT/MT roles are the elephants in the room.

[SirTaint]

100% agree Xeno.

The other thing almost never mentioned is part of the reason Elysium went with a DRK MT was so they could swap out their MNK for a NIN. It was a net gain from a two position move and not just to get rid of the PLD. Once the normal raiding world gets to A3S MNK and PLD will be viable. There is actually a lot of Physical damage in A3.