AST Sect Theory

[Apeiron]

Something to consider about this argument (the one in which the Hots are ticking, but people are full health) is that if you accept that this is the case, it makes things swing in diurnal's favor since you're accepting that people are topped off often enough that overhealing becomes an issue. Edit: Or it could mean that your cohealer is throwing out too many heals, but that's a seperate issue.

As far as how often these HoTs actually do tick when people are at full hp, experience tells me that people end up spending a lot of time at less than 100% hp when you have an AST in the party, hence overhealing ends up being not so much of a concern.

A good point, one I'll admit I didn't think about, but overhealing is something likely to come up. Maybe not the whole party, but ones and twos could definitely be there. While it might not much of a concern, I still like to know what that would do to numbers.

Yes, Diurnal has more overheal because of HoTs. Adjusted for overheal, I'd say Diurnal is still about 20% stronger. This is when under near maximum stress in terms of healing output, and assumes you are paired with a WHM and not a SCH, where your shields can overwrite and skew the numbers. Also, a WHM at maximum HPS heals for about 35% more than a Diurnal AST, and about 75% more than Nocturnal, for anyone who cares. A SCH can also easily match (or beat) your maximum HPS in Nocturnal while still outputting 200+ more DPS than you depending on the fight.

Just want to make sure I got the intended jab right: you're saying the overwriting of shields, the damage mitigation things, the things which don't tick up potency (and HP) beyond their initial cure potency, and can't be stacked, can skewer numbers? Am I right? Because that's what I'm reading.

We'll agree on the easily match/beat comment for HPS from SCH, but is it really only 200+ DPS? That doesn't seem right. The fight depending, still, they've got plenty of DoTs to drop and let work. I'd figure it to be a bit higher. Oh well.

Even more so, though, I want to know the 75% comes from. If Diurnal is ~20% stronger, the WHM shouldn't be ~75% stronger than the Noctast. That's a huge disparity in numbers. There's a whole ~40% missing. Using HPS with your statement, that would mean a WHM at 600HPS outpaces the AST in Noct by 450HPS (who would be doing a pitiful 150HPS) ... that's more than a little problem, and I'm not ready to buy the accuracy of that statement. I'd have bought your statement if you'd said 55%, but 75% is exaggerating a bit much don't you think?

So your plan is for the Nocturnal AST with the SCH to ignore half of their skills.. That is ludicrous. Benefic 2 in Nocturnal is 651 potency while it is 620 in Diurnal, but casts 5% faster. It ends up being the same overall. You can't just continue to ignore the spell speed granted by Diurnal and you cant ask a Nocturnal AST to ignore half of their heals. That in itself ruins the validity of any argument this could ever have of being viable.

Again, not ignore. They'd simply be prioritizing it lower on their list of spells to use first.

I haven't ignored the 5% to spell speed, it just hasn't come up. But, since you've brought it up now.... Currently, at 53, the 5% puts my cast time at... I want to say 2.28seconds compared to my Noctast's 2.40. The purpose of the spell speed increase seems to have been the dev. teams way of making sure the lower potency healing of Diurnal could keep up with the boosted healing potency of Nocturnal. Imagine attempting to heal as a Diurnast with the lower potency and same GCD as the Noctast, it'd be utterly horrid.

Now, to the cast faster it certainly does that, but to get a tangible benefit out of that type of speed you'd need to stack more spell speed. As it is Diurnal AST doesn't really start dusting Nocturnal AST in terms of time until after the 5th Benefic II where it shaves off a whole second and takes 12.20 seconds to get to (just to get twice as much out of the spell speed buff you'd have to double that time and then some). Until then it looks like you're talking .XX seconds. Again, this is using lvl53 ilvl123 gear, not sure if this stays constant or if higher skill speed makes the difference greater (need more numbers!). This can be modified by your card buffs, but that's a game of RNG, where you're the only person who could possibly benefit from the card (hint, hint, you're not).

But yeah, that's straight Benefic II, and you probably shouldn't be chain casting Benefic II 5 times in a row. It still wouldn't beat the Nocturnast Benefic II, though. Speed, sure, but not by a lot. The difference in potency for them would be 155 (Noctast at 3255, Diurnast at 3100). With every cast of Benefic II, the Nocturnast would also gain a lead on the Diurnasts raw heals by 31 potency. Something that could easily be fixed if they stop to cast A. Benefic where they trade out up front heals for a lower potency just to catch up, to combine their HoT with Benefic II.