Crafting is dead

[Sibyll]

I kinda lost faith in the specialisation thing back with desynthing. Everything was on a fairly even keel (from what i was reading in my craft and gathering LS) and then they added the wedding stuff that could be desynthed. If you had made the right choice and picked LTW for desynth, then great for you; but if you'd picked WVR, then pay twice as much gil for the same chance.

I get what you are saying but I think desynth killed it for me the day that GSM was the only reliable source of mastercraft demimateria. When it comes to leveling desynths the balance is horribly off. ALC and BSM are two of my desynths (ARM is the third) and comparing the cost of leveling those compared to GSM is a joke.

Aetherial Reduction is what desynth should've been from the beginning. The leveling, the gil sink, and the lack of balance killed it for me. It doesn't end at desynth either. It took them until the expansion to realize that the recipe balance between classes was trash.

-Where are the 1* recipes? Why did they practically skip an entire tier?
I've not read anyone else on the forums mention this, but we essentially have an entire tier of gear progression skipped. Most of the crafting classes do not even have any 1* recipes at 60.
-Why are normal recipes gated behind a master recipe book
-Why are master book recipes required for leveling leve quests
-Why do all crafting materials require several times as much raw materials to make
-Why did all the scrips recipes reward scrips based on total amount of materials rather then whether those materials are locked behind node, hunted, or easily gathered.
-Why do nearly all recipes require materials from up to 5( 5!) different crafting classes.
-Why force material requirements from other specific crafting classes (IE: push alch disolvents on all dow/dom items)
-Why lock crafting classes behind (higher level) gathering classes, and why lock those behind the MSQ
-Where are the 1* recipes from blacksmithing, carpenter and the remaining 1* recipes for the rest of the classes?
-They made a feature of ''new type of nodes'' that wouldnt be timed and we could gather them more easily, rather then unspoiled nodes that were time based. Then they gave us unspoiled nodes anyway. Except they spawn twice as often, and give half the resources.
-Why are most of the 2 dozen orso unspoiled nodes sharing one two (3 if you spam cordials) timers? Would it have been too obvious to just place the items on the same node?
-Speaking of obvious: why are there several scrips turn in items on the same node, ensuring that one is completely pointless.
-Why do all HW quests give 2 full (apart from 3 accesories, that drop plenty in dungeons) sets of HQ crafter made equipment.
And why did they bother to add the recipe lists to the log anyway?
-Why add many new refined materials when they are only use for 2 levels.
-Why are there no 51-55 gathering nodes in the lower half of the sea of clouds.
-Why is anything above the first collectible unobtainable with leveling perception, untill you reach 58/59+ or are decked out in lucis+ food
I mean these are ment for leveling. So what is the point of these stats requirements if the people still leveling cant obtain them.
-Why were only a handful of furnishing recipes added. And why were they added to the master books (apart from the GSM recipe for some reason)
-Why are many of the important raw materials HIDDEN, meaning they only have 1/3th the harvest rates. As if requiring 5 of these to make one item isnt bad enough, thats equivalent of needing 15 (15!) materials for one item.

You bring up a lot of good points.

1) The dependence on unspoiled nodes, hidden/rare materials and increased raw materials per synth I think is their push to add longevity to a full time gatherer. Unspoiled mats were really the only gathered mats worth selling in ARR, especially after beast tribes provided many refined materials below level 40-50. You could argue this is to encourage people to specialize as pure gatherers or pure crafters rather than both.

2) Master recipes being required for quests and leves I really just think is the devs way of including Master book progression into the leveling process.

3) The lack of 1* recipes is baffling. I don't understand why they even had them there for the 2-3 week period before 2* got released, which was the real first tier of * recipes.

4) It's apparent from a design stand point that they wanted people to level DoW to 60 and finish MSQ before even touching DoH/DoL due to the gate on many of the required materials (I'm looking at you Wyvern Skin), hence why they hand out HQ gear in quests. However, I really wonder why crafting exists at all if it's niche is going to be gearing secondary DoW/DoM and making BiS DoH/DoL. Crafting in other MMOs may not be as in-depth, but at least the end products are desired in those games.

5) The shared/reduced timers on nodes is to prevent people from hitting every single unspoiled node like in ARR. Nodes also spawn twice a day (except folklore). I actually liked this design.

I just don't understand their end game for crafting. If they wanted to eliminate omnicrafting, there were better ways to do it. If they wanted to stimulate the economy, there were better ways to do it. The expansion feels like more time was spent on improving DoL gameplay, and I think for the most part they did improve them in making their materials more desired. However, they seem like they just phoned it in on the DoH aspect. The specialist system promised much, but delivered very little in terms of any attempt changing the meta up or giving purpose to many of the base skills.

[Alahra]

It took them until the expansion to realize that the recipe balance between classes was trash.

Honestly, I'd say by and large that it still is, though it's a little better than it used to be.

[Ksenia]

Lets just drop the gloves, piss or get off the pot.

If SqEnix want to kill Omni Crafting and have us all play RnG fail farm 14, they can play RnG. It involves putting 2 years of development on the line.

You want to kill Omni? put Hasty Touch to 50% base. (Steady Hand & Steady Hand II don't effect Haste actions) Watch all Omni rotations evaporate. The synergy in CP recovery from 0 use Hasty, stable inner quiet stacking and relative reliability of Hasty with SH II is lost.

Because crafting is purley cosmetic and has no impact on end game MSQ or raids, it's very RnG if it doesn't vaporize the crafting community. Housing, Airship and such are not HQ driven, you can spam Steady Hand 1 and Standard Synth to get that stuff, you killed your own content again.

Go to it SqEnix.

- Disclaimers: I haven't read, seen or heard anything from SE to suggest they don't like cross class, Omni crafting. It's in the game, they consider it when they develop but I know of nothing that indicates they want it gone. The plain fact is, you can craft with one crafting class. You do however need all HQ and you do need a free company or link shell of like minded people. If 8 people with a single craft exchanged their parts and focused on HQ only, getting crafted stuff using single class rotations is possible. Also, I'm not suggesting I think killing Omni is the brightest idea out there. I'm simply saying, they can do it if that's the thorn in their side.

[seorin]

Desynth is when I lost faith in crafting entirely. We keep getting more RNG based grinds instead of actual content. Ixal dailies are the exception, but those had to be accessible so non-crafters wouldn't be locked out of the last beast tribe. SE seems to think crafters actually want longer grinds and more RNG, but I keep seeing more friends give up crafting with each major addition.

I personally gave up at the master 2 books and I'm glad for it. That's when the time investment and RNG made crafting suck more fun out of the game for me than it added. After hearing they wanted to make crafting more accessible I hoped to get back into it because it was fun before the stupid grind, but now it's worse than ever. That makes me sad. I want to enjoy crafting with my friends, not have it locked away to all but the most hardcore players. For every one person posting in this forum, there are a dozen who take one look at the gaping maw of the crafting ouroboros and run in the opposite direction.

[Alahra]

I didn't realize how few 1-star recipes there are overall. I thought WVR and ALC just got the short end of the stick... (I'm not planning on omnicrafting this expansion, so I've only got those two at 60 for now).

I knew things felt odd since the original structure was 1-star crafting/gathering AF to make/gather the 2-star items/materials, but I hadn't really put it together that they essentially skipped 1-star progression entirely...

[Jade-Nephrite]

It's very strange the progression of recipes, and just the materials in general.

Dragon / Amphiptere skins - mob drops
Aurum Regis Sand - Normal Node
Adamantite - Timed Node - 1 per gather
Crawler Cocoon - Mob drop
Chimera Mane - Mob drop
Birch Log - Hidden gather

Makes Hunter Retainers pretty awesome!

[maelor]

I agree with pretty much everything here, its near death. Please SE fix this, its so fun to have crafting goals that are reachable AND rewarding in the long run, but it is now and has been for a while that crafting is very time consuming with little payout. I say little payout because if you craft something nice and meld it, once you out grow it you lose the materia you out into it, which is a HUGE loss. Sure, desynthing lets you reclaim some of the mats, but the materia is what really makes a piece worth even wearing, because without the materia there are better pieces to be gotten from dungeons and raids, and they are easier to get. Finally the dungeon and raid gear can be turned in when you're done with it. Crafted gear gets crafted, becomes obsolete, then once its obsolete you truly have no use for it and get nothing back from it. I want to have crafting goals that are end goals and that are not necessarily easy to reach, but are not insanely hard to reach.