The positive Astrologian thread!

[TatoRazzino]

All the first week savage clears with Astrologians are there to prove the job is fine if played well. People are just bad and need some carries.

[Vihalo]

All the first week savage clears with Astrologians are there to prove the job is fine if played well.

It just proves that if you have an Astrologian in the party the first two bosses can be healed, it doesn't prove that AST is on paar with WHM and SCH in progress raiding.
It doesn't prove that the (weak and RNG) buffs of AST justify the lack of healing cooldowns.

When you progress a boss you don't need RNG buffs with a little mana buff or a little bit more tp, or 1,X% more raiddamage on a RNG basis that the cards provide. You need consistency. You need reliable heal cooldowns, because you do trial and error with a boss because things will always go wrong on your first boss try's. You need enough healing power to try as long as possible to practice after a boss pull before the wipe. You need an off healer that can provide dps safely, because you know you have the heal cooldowns, when something goes wrong, to safe the damage dealer fastly after he stood in the fire. AST simply does not provide this kind of healing cd's.

How many AST's where brought on the world first kills on Alexander Savage 1,2,3? I saw none. Everything was WHM and SCH. AST just isn't played on a high player level, and it's that way for a reason.
In a Boss try where everything goes right, AST might be decent. But other than that.. WHM and SCH are just the better option for progress raiding. At the moment AST is just a gimmick healer.

[TatoRazzino]

Snip

The reason why people are not bringing Astrologians to high end progression groups is that it requires a learning curve to play the job on raids, since there's no dummy you can practice healing checks on. People don't want to learn both the fight and the new strategy that a new healing job requires. That takes time and people who want World 1st want to do it as fast as they can, so they're sticking to the old meta. That doesn't mean that AST is not as good as the others, it means it's different and that it was not meant to replace the old healing strategy, but to create new ones. This should be obvious, but players are showing that they can't understand the basics about FF XIV gameplay. The bitching about cards or cooldowns shows that. If you can't play ir right and progress with it, it means you need to get good. If you're struggling, you suck. Don't blame the job, blame yourself.

[Vihalo]

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The thing is: The basic healing tools of Astrologian are basically just carbon coby's of Whitemage 2.0. with very few minor changes, so there is not much new to learn. The card system is not that complicated. Astrologian is not a magical box you open with a hidden key and suddenly you become good.

Top guilds are not so stupid that they have to learn this in months and months of time. If Astrologian had something to offer that is desireable to bring AST to progress they would take AST with them. They know the game very well, that is why they are on top.

[TatoRazzino]

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That means you failed to grasp the concept and how the "minor" changes affect gameplay. If it was carbon copy, people wouldn't be having problems to heal with the job. The fact that they are, even though the spells are "almost the same", means that there's a different gameplay. And it's not months of time, we're talking about days or hours. Top guilds have realized that the cards are not going to boost DPS to make it meet dps checks that wouldn't be met otherwise and that the presence of an AST would mean that there's new strategies to develop, learn and master. They don't want to invest time in that, because that could be easy to do or very hard, depending on the fight. Sticking to the known is safer and requires less effort. This is not a problem. People should be able to do fights with WHM/SCH and it's easier because we've been doing it since 2.0. Just stop adding problems to a job just because you're not skilled enough to play it properly.

[Vihalo]

That means you failed to grasp the concept and how the "minor" changes affect gameplay. If it was carbon copy, people wouldn't be having problems to heal with the job.

Yep.. the missing heal cooldowns are a big difference.. what other skills of AST would require a brand-new complicated strategy exactly again?

Also your theory is that because of minor changes (they really are minor, just compare them) of basic healing tools in comparison to white mage we all have so much problems?
So all this discussions in the japanese forums (173 pages thread now) and english forums are only because the people just can't play the job? C'mon.
Well let's just agree to disagree. We will see on the next raid tier if the top raid guilds solved this puzzle and maybe then they will take AST with them.