Skill Trees

[uryu17]

I think you are ignorant or clearly uninformed of how MMOs work these days. Sure there are lots of other games with the skill tree system but in an MMO environment it is nothing more than creating a layer of make belief for players to think that theres variety for them to choose on how they want to play.

So let me get this right dear sir. So if I'm playing STWOR and I spec my sorcerer for healing instead of dps. The healing that I'm doing is an illusion. Well I guess you have proven your point. that really did make since... Could you please post a susseful modern MMO without skill trees? Ty man. FYI I rather be fooled into believing that I'm healing using that healer spec vs not having the option. Cough cough what you said was ridiculous to me<--- In case your giant brain was not able to fathom the sarcasm. ������ ty for stating your opinion I appreciate it.sorcerer
Btw when did I state anything about modern MMOs (Everquest 2,wow, stor,blade and successful games) . These game implemented the skill tree correctly. If SE implements it correctly there should be no problem. Their way does not have to be like the modern Games you play or the ones I mention.

[PotatoWafflez]

So let me get this right dear sir. So if I'm playing STWOR and I spec my sorcerer for healing instead of dps. The healing that I'm doing is an illusion. Well I guess you have proven your point. that really did make since... Could you please post a susseful modern MMO without skill trees? Ty man. FYI I rather be fooled into believing that I'm healing using that healer spec vs not having the option. Cough cough what you said was ridiculous to me<--- I case your giant brain was not able to fathom the sarcasm. ������

Specs are not the same as skill trees.
All you are doing is choosing a class. You Might thing you are playing a Sorcerer-Healer But actually you are playing Healer y that is attached to the same base as DPS x and z. You can't use your DPS rotation in your healing spec and vice versa so it's not what you are actually asking for here at all and if you are well guess what its already in the game it just isn't in a sub menu and you literally change your job to healer y without also being stuck only being able to choose DPS x and z you can also switch to tanks a, b or c or any of the other "specs/classes" in the game at any time with no strings attached other than unlocking and leveling/gearing them.

[uryu17]

Party finder would like to have words
No Ilvl:xxx? Kick/Can't join
Fail once? Kick
First time exp bonus? Kick/Disband
Wiped? Disband

In 2.0 get DF Ifirit HM/EX No caster? Disband/Bail

So you tell me again how people wont force people into doing something a certain way.
And that is without touching on in depth the "optimum setup/rotation" guides that people will be expected to follow to do any serious content.

Are you trying to help my argument? This is the perfect example of why we could use skill trees. Also if someone doesn't want you in their group do to you not being able to do your job. That is not the rotation fault it's yours. You don't have to use someone rotation to complete content. Even though the rotations you can use are limited. That's SE fault thus the reason why I'm propsing the idea of using Skill trees to give us more freedom.

[uryu17]

Example let's say what you say is true. There is one rotation and if we don't use it we can't complete the content. Well if we have more option we don't have to follow the same rotation and still meet the end goal using different tools and or skills vs the same rotation that everyone else is using all the time. All I'm saying is I'm tried of figuring out a rotation only to hope online and see someone else came to the same conclustion. I want to be so what unique...

[uryu17]

Specs are not the same as skill trees.
All you are doing is choosing a class. You Might thing you are playing a Sorcerer-Healer But actually you are playing Healer y that is attached to the same base as DPS x and z. You can't use your DPS rotation in your healing spec and vice versa so it's not what you are actually asking for here at all and if you are well guess what its already in the game it just isn't in a sub menu and you literally change your job to healer y without also being stuck only being able to choose DPS x and z you can also switch to tanks a, b or c or any of the other "specs/classes" in the game at any time with no strings attached other than unlocking and leveling/gearing them.

All I can say to this is wow... You spec in skill tree, when your friend ask you what did you spec in, you reply dps support or healer. Not sure what mmos you have played, but that's how it works in the ones I play man.

[PotatoWafflez]

All I can say to this is wow... You spec in skill tree, when your friend ask you what did you spec in, you reply dps support or healer. Not sure what mmos you have played, but that's how it works in the ones I play man.

Which is totally not the same as just picking a healer class that has the same skills as choosing your healer spec out of your dps/support/healer specs only you don't have to make that choice because you already made it when you picked the healer class?
You have 1 "class" it has "3 roles" those 3 roles are actually "3 different classes" cut out the middle man and just have the 3 classes the only reason other MMORPGS even have this system is because you can't play everyone class on one character like you can on here.

Also you have cross class skills. There is your customisation only everyone uses the same ones because they give the most benefit just like every other talent system in the history of MMORPGs.

[uryu17]

I see what your saying, but having the classes on one character does not really matter at all man. It's a QOL and thing. Yeah you have all the classes on one character, so what? You still have to level them and thier still different classes. The cross class is not very customizable its a you take what you can get and most of the skill are useless for your class.why give me a skill you know I would never use? There controlling my ever decision.I love oils like a lil more freedom. Also I have said hah it does not have to be a skill tree I just want more options you know.

[Nurvus]

Why do people keep asking for skill trees? SCH and SMN are exactly this, minus the few 'choice' decisions. It's horrible and you should feel bad for wanting it. You don't even get the illusion of choice - everyone will tell you that you're bad and your build is wrong. True balance needs to be able to rely on what players will and will not have, you can't balance around 'what if'. XIV has done amazing at balance thus far (Compared to other games).

Skill trees (Vanilla WoW) are horrible. Fake choice.
Talent "lines" (WoD WoW) are decent. You actually get meaningful choices.
Sphere Grid FFX style has great potential if we only get enough points to fill (at most) 80% and/or have the ability to customize some (not all) nodes.

[Darc18]

That's exactly what I've been told.
If talents or skill trees are implemented most would just choose the same build for maximized results

[Kuwagami]

snip

Specs (heal, supp, dps, whatever) are very different from skill trees (different skills within the same spec). And when it comes down to that, there is always an optimal skill set you'll have to get because it gives the best dps/heal/support/tank options for your class. You end up with no choice, as there is only one that people will want you to have, so the whole point of having a skill tree in the first place is void.

No choice is better than an illusion of choice.

see cross class skills as an example. Illusion of choice, most of them are trash, and you end up forced to have an "optimal" set, or rather a "least useless" set for some jobs.