Unjust Kicking from Alexander T4

[3Jane]

I agree that the kick was unjust. You made the mistake once. Not over and over. Plus you were new.

However, they're not obligated to type out all the mechanics for you (a random pug), just like you're not obligated to know the mechanics. It bugs me when newbies rage at vets for not holding their hands. I know you didn't rage - I'm just saying that it's a pet peeve of mine when it does happen.

It's just a matter of common courtesy and manners isn't it. In the interests of entertainment, fun and being sociable. Surely people don't only do things unless they fell themselves obliged to.

[Elim]

It's just a matter of common courtesy and manners isn't it. In the interests of entertainment, fun and being sociable. Surely people don't only do things unless they fell themselves obliged to.

Not sure which side you're referring to. You can apply that argument to both. You could say, "It's common courtesy to watch a video or read a guide so you don't hold up seven people. You're not a special snowflake. This is a social game and you have to think about other people, not just yourself." or "It's common courtesy to teach new players. This is a social game and you have to think about other people, not just yourself."

Neither are common courtesy, nor do they have anything to do with manners. IMO. It's entirely based on how someone wants to play the game/spend their free time.

[Fatedkiss]

I don't actually know how to start this reply nor do I often post on here. So i shall start by saying that everything here will be my opinion and should only be viewed as one persons view of the current state of the game.

It appears to me as time goes on that the community especially end game is getting increasingly more toxic.

Exhibit A: This thread was created about a group that kicked someone for simply making a mistake and bothering to ask for clarification from what he was originally told about the fight.

We have people going back and forth between "watch a video" or "read a guide", as well as people saying that they wish to simply enjoy the game and learn from it the way that every group that creates these "Guides" has actually done themselves. We watch guides yet only see the win that they achieved and not the countless times they have wiped learning that fight. Then to make it worse it becomes assumed that everyone else who has watched that video must be able to replicate what they saw and avoid all mechanics within just a small couple of attempts.

The justification people use for being rude is "don't waste our time". I would beg to differ that by playing FFXIV you are currently "wasting your time" due to the fact you are currently using extra time you have outside of real life duties to be playing said game.

This toxicity even stems into party finder where we ask people to go to learn. often getting learning groups who disband after a few failed attempts or get someone who rage quits. You also have the groups that want to clear yet refuse to accept any mistakes with aggressive comments such as "will kick if your bad" or "don't make mistakes". We are humans and we are an imperfect species.

Yet we treat each other like dirt and demand everyone to be perfect. the sad thing is it wont ever end, everyone is entitled to their opinions and ideals. we just often suffer from it.

Thank for taking the time to read this if you did. again its just my opinion and I know mine are often not shared with others.

[Goodberry]

I don't actually know how to start this reply nor do I often post on here. So i shall start by saying that everything here will be my opinion and should only be viewed as one persons view of the current state of the game.

It appears to me as time goes on that the community especially end game is getting increasingly more toxic.

Exhibit A: This thread was created about a group that kicked someone for simply making a mistake and bothering to ask for clarification from what he was originally told about the fight.

We have people going back and forth between "watch a video" or "read a guide", as well as people saying that they wish to simply enjoy the game and learn from it the way that every group that creates these "Guides" has actually done themselves. We watch guides yet only see the win that they achieved and not the countless times they have wiped learning that fight. Then to make it worse it becomes assumed that everyone else who has watched that video must be able to replicate what they saw and avoid all mechanics within just a small couple of attempts.

The justification people use for being rude is "don't waste our time". I would beg to differ that by playing FFXIV you are currently "wasting your time" due to the fact you are currently using extra time you have outside of real life duties to be playing said game.

This toxicity even stems into party finder where we ask people to go to learn. often getting learning groups who disband after a few failed attempts or get someone who rage quits. You also have the groups that want to clear yet refuse to accept any mistakes with aggressive comments such as "will kick if your bad" or "don't make mistakes". We are humans and we are an imperfect species.

Yet we treat each other like dirt and demand everyone to be perfect. the sad thing is it wont ever end, everyone is entitled to their opinions and ideals. we just often suffer from it.

Thank for taking the time to read this if you did. again its just my opinion and I know mine are often not shared with others.

Great post, I agree 100%.

[Twilite]

I agree that the kick was unjust. You made the mistake once. Not over and over. Plus you were new.

However, they're not obligated to type out all the mechanics for you (a random pug), just like you're not obligated to know the mechanics. It bugs me when newbies rage at vets for not holding their hands. I know you didn't rage - I'm just saying that it's a pet peeve of mine when it does happen.

It's not hand holding. . .

It's a vote, no ?
If the majority decided to kick, it's their right, no ?
If the community is too toxic for some people, you can quit and play a more friendly game, no ?
And yeah, I seriously hope you can find 1. Oh wait there's hello kitty online

Toxic this; Just shut the hell up.

[Jin-]

FFXIV was the first MMORPG where i saw things like this:

- Did you watch Youtube videos before entering the dungeon
- Did you watch the guides before entering the dungeon

If you response, no i did not? Then you are noob and bad player.

This is strange community. Dungeons are supposed to be learned by playing them, wiping, learning by mistake, improving etc... And not how some elitists want that people should watch some videos lol .

This was in Ultimate Ballad. Easily learned after couple of wipes.

[MilesSaintboroguh]

FFXIV was the first MMORPG where i saw things like this:

- Did you watch Youtube videos before entering the dungeon
- Did you watch the guides before entering the dungeon

If you response, no i did not? Then you are noob and bad player.

This is strange community. Dungeons are supposed to be learned by playing them, wiping, learning by mistake, improving etc... And not how some elitists want that people should watch some videos lol .

This was in Ultimate Ballad. Easily learned after couple of wipes.

It's all about farming fast as possible now.

[Nadirah]

FFXIV was the first MMORPG where i saw things like this:

- Did you watch Youtube videos before entering the dungeon
- Did you watch the guides before entering the dungeon

If you response, no i did not? Then you are noob and bad player.

You must have never played WoW.

The *only* game that I've played where this was *not* a thing, was Everquest 2, and that was only because the boss strats were kept secret from everyone until the fights were well outdated.

Unless you had connections in a higher ranked guild, you had to make your own strats, and video guides were near non existent when I played last.

Granted, this was 2012 when I stopped hardcore raiding there, so it may have changed since. We had someone that was friends with a guy in the dev guild on Guk that we got strats and GuildConnect strings from.

[Umo]

Dungeons are supposed to be learned by playing them, wiping, learning by mistake, improving etc...

That 'etc.' should include "Not on Duty Finder".

[Seoulstar]

It is common courtesy to help new players as well. Not everyone can learn from a youtube video. I've watched plenty of videos on a fight..and failed horribly. Then someone explains and and I'm doing much better. People need to stop assuming that a youtube video is the silver bullet.