Thread: Monk 3.0 CHAKRA UNLEASHED

Originally Posted by Hivernica

I'm really sorry to interrupt with noob talk, but I have a few questions.
My main dps class (I main scholar) used to be monk back in 2.x before I realized I really liked dragoon as well. After getting all healers, DRK, DRG, NIN and BRD to 60, I decided to do monk. To be honest I don't know why I waited to so long, I still love monk. I'm currently lvl53, soon to be lvl54.

My first question is: should I really worry about fracture? I'm the kind of person who wants to do their best and not just be "ok", but whenever I try to use it I end up losing DK or TS for one GCD or 2. Never more than that though. It's quite annoying, so I was wondering if the dps gain from fracture was really worth it.

My second question is: what's forbidden chakra? I've checked the new skills online and form shift, elixir field, meditation, tornado kick and purification make 5 skills. Does the meditation icon change to forbidden chakra once you get 5 stacks, kinda like the icon of the draw ability changes when you draw a card on astrologian?

If you want to do maximum DPS then, yes, you will need to learn how to use Fracture properly. With that being said there are times to use it and there are times to not use it. It is a filler ability to extend a rotation to reduce Demolish clipping only. There some set criteria that has to be considered if you are using Fracture; do not try to keep it up 100% of the time, if you refresh ToD during a Dragon Kick/Twin Snakes buff cycle do not use Fracture, if you are on a fresh Dragon Kick/Twin Snakes buff cycle and you do not need to refresh ToD and Demo has ~5-6 second left at the time you will refresh do use Fracture. That's really the basics of using it. In practice it's not so clear cut since you have phase/jump timings to worry about. Sometimes it's better to use Fracture over ToD if you know that ToD won't run it's course. If TP starvation is going to be a problem Fracture is the first thing to cut. I'd really skip Fracture until you're 60. You time up to 60 I recommend getting very comfortable with everything else.

Forbidden Chakra and Meditation are the same ability. Once you get Meditation to 5 stack then it turns into Forbidden Chakra. Once at 5 stacks you have the option to use Forbidden Chakra or Purification to consume those stacks.

I'd really focus on getting down a solid opener that you are comfortable with, maximizing your oGCD usage and timing, and when to or when to not use Meditation mid combat (learning which mechanics and breaks afford you enough time to use it without cutting your GCD uptime on the boss). Fracture is really the last thing I tell people to learn about since it's not a large DPS increase and is very specific in application, but it is needed at times to maximize output.

From earlier in the thread:

Originally Posted by valsemiel

FS x3 > BFB @ 1 on macro > ST > Dem + (PB) > SP > SP > DK + (Pot) > TwS + (IR) > Fracture + (EF) > BS + (StP) > TS + (HF) > Dem + (FC) > ToD

I imagine the early BFB lets you combo #2 with IR and allows you to get 3 total by P3. As for the rest, I'm not entirely sure. He uses a pot before IR which is something I don't see often (is there some advantage to this or vice versa?) Then he opts to Fracture instead of SP on his last second of PB which I'm guessing is to maximize DoT uptime on the boss for that phase as you can only fit in 1 ToD anyway vs 2 Fractures if you use it early. All this yields him roughly 1800+ DPS by the end of P1 (he even reports 1900 which I find to be insanely high) and 1600-1700 by the end of P2. I actually had a fellow MNK use DK for me, a NIN and an AST with Enhanced Balance (+15%) and I never ended P1 anywhere near 1900 so I'm wondering what other people usually burst there.

Based on this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AC4uWjzM2GQ

Tried this yesterday and it is a menace with Balance. I didn't realize before that his jello ass was invulnerable during transition - refreshing DoTs was a big mistake.

Yeah, DoTs don't tick during his invuln so refreshing them is wasted potency. As for the opener, I just wanted to elaborate on the key differences.

Opener:

FS x3 > BFB @ 1 on macro > ST > Dem + (PB) > SP > SP > DK + (Pot) > TwS + (IR) > Fracture + (EF) > BS + (StP) > TS + (HF) > Dem (Clipped) + (FC) > ToD

Buff order is debatable. Definitely want the Fracture though since it'll let you fit in 2. Clipping the Demolish also let's you fit in 3. Also, StP as 2nd OGCD let's you fit in another one exactly before phase shift.


After the opener you'll want to do this:

DK > TwS > SP > BS > TS + (ST) > Fracture > Dem (Clipped) > DK > TwS > SP > BS + (EF) > TS > SP > DK > TwS > SP > BS + (StP)

Key here is dot clipping again. The final few GCDs may be SkS dependent. For me, ~575 worked just fine.

One other tiny thing I noticed using this rotation is that I don't think I ever missed a positional due to mechanics. Using Fracture instead of SP during PB let's you bait Protean Wave south and allows you hit your rear positionals afterward without having to worry about being stuck between 2 claustrophobic pizza slices (since traditional opener forces you to be around the flank for Snap Punch during bait). While you can squeeze in, I usually play it safe and just True Strike the flank which is a 40 potency loss (trivial yes, but everything counts when you're going for a #1 parse). Maybe I'm overanalyzing it and Momo didn't actually make these considerations when crafting his opener, but I really feel like he put alot of thought into optimizing that first phase.

Originally Posted by valsemiel

Maybe I'm overanalyzing it and Momo didn't actually make these considerations when crafting his opener, but I really feel like he put alot of thought into optimizing that first phase.

I'm going to say no, that he did tailor his opener/rotation to the fight. He clips demo because at that exact time he will get the full timer of one more demolish. Had he not clipped it and used it in the next rotation that one would be also clipped and if he got 5 tics out of that he would break even in potency, however if he gets 4 tics he actually loses potency, he would get roughly 14 seconds in of demolish, which is roughly 4.6 tics. Either way his first method should at worst go even. That being said the first demo clip is at 5 seconds, Im not sure if thats a given 2 tics lost, or a potential 1 at best. If 5 secs will still have a potential of 1 tic lost, then his method of how he clipped his demo still gains more advantage. When he clips demo the ninja also applies trick attack, sadly I dont think he gets the vuln in time for demo, but it looks like that was also considered but could just be coincidence.

Originally Posted by SunnyHirose

I'm interested in any theories/equations/methods you can share on this.

We basically take two different approaches. In both cases, we figure out what your crit rate and expected tick amount are.

Once we have those numbers, ACT and FFLogs do two different things. ACT ignores the actual combined tick amount reported in-game and instead simulates a DoT amount by combining T and C to produce a new number, N. So in ACT you basically always do your "expected amount" of DoT damage.

In FFLogs, I fit to the actual combined tick amount, assigning each player a portion of the tick based off their percentage of the total. This method works well for a small # of DoTs/HoTs.

The fact that people consistently come in lower on FFLogs makes me think there are two potential issues in play: (1) Maybe DoTs don't crit quite as much as ACT thinks they do, or (2) Maybe the game is not reporting the correct combined tick amounts and/or underreporting that damage.