Dark Knight - Bad case of Delirium

[OliviaBadger]

-10% INT is insanely good, and is why monks were so useful in raids - T13 progression was significantly easier with a monk in the party due to all the hard hitting raid-wide magic AOEs. It stacks with WARs storm debuff so a DRK/WAR combo will give a -20% magic damage to the whole raid, and -30% if you have reprisal up.

As others have said, no need to worry about gimping monk damage - it doesn't overwrite dragon kick, but DK overwrites delirium. Delirium combo as you say is your highest potency combo by 10(not including DA souleater), although you will get more benefit from using more souleater combos (with DA when you can afford it) if you have a monk applying DK.

[Marxam]

The int debuff is one of the biggest raid wide non healer mitigation abilities in the game. It is superb IMO. In non echo final coil it could literally be the difference between a raid wipe and survival depending on the hp threshold and gear level of your team.

I'm not denying that but every serious end game raid party will always have a mnk meaning dragon kick will be up 100%, which goes back to the issue of is Delirium only useful for its dmg? It just feels like it lacks the synergy that nin and war has. I say make the DRK deal blunt damage since realism doesn't matter in this game anymore. *looks at monks patas* >.>

[OliviaBadger]

I'm not denying that but every serious end game raid party will always have a mnk meaning dragon kick will be up 100%,

I mentioned this is another post too, but having a monk and a drk in your party is still good synergy. A monk applying DK means more souleaters for you, and in cases like Alex 1, the boss splits in two so the monk cannot DK both of them.

[Allyrion]

I mentioned this is another post too, but having a monk and a drk in your party is still good synergy. A monk applying DK means more souleaters for you, and in cases like Alex 1, the boss splits in two so the monk cannot DK both of them.

How would you afford more DA SE?
Wouldn't you do the DE combo anyway to regen mana?
DE still does more potency than a non DA SE, so I thought it'd be better to use DE combo to finish a syphon strike combo.

I think it'd be nice if DRK reduced their blunt resistance.
Though it's a little weird to reduce the resistance of a damage type you don't do. WAR/NIN both do slashing.
But it would be interesting because it's unique and DRK could use the utility/synergy.

[Rhaja]

I just want to add in here that Swords aren't exactly as sharp as people believe. The giant swords DRK uses could honestly be blunter than hell, and due to weight and shape would still be able to sever like a one handed sword.

I was seriously hoping SE would add that in and make them blunt, giving them synergy with Monk. Hell Monk doesn't even use blunt weapons anymore, and their still called blunt. For what, Dragon Kick?

[OliviaBadger]

I meant more souleaters but not necessarily DA'd, as MT. A vanilla souleater is only 20 potency less than a Delirium - the heal you get from it in my eyes is more beneficial as MT than that 20 potency (assuming monk doing DK)

[Allyrion]

I meant more souleaters but not necessarily DA'd, as MT. A vanilla souleater is only 20 potency less than a Delirium - the heal you get from it in my eyes is more beneficial as MT than that 20 potency (assuming monk doing DK)

That's probably true.
Still, it's not even a pure gain. There's a trade off of minor potency for a minor heal.

NIN gains something like 50 dps from a WAR being in the party, and a much easier rotation to manage.
DRK synergy with MNK, you drop some potency for a small heal.

That's nice and I guess it counts, but it's not really comparable to WAR/NIN, BRD/Casters or DRG/Ranged.

[TouchandFeel]

^
That's actually one of my biggest issues with DRK, asides from the bugs and some of the abilities not feeling responsive (looking at you ground-targetted Salted Earth).

DRK just doest really feel like it brings the level of raid/group utility that the other classes, particularly the other tanks, do.

WAR brings the pain with good MT dps and the best OT dps, plus a good raid damage buff (+slashing) and good raid defensive buff (-damage done).

PLD brings respectable damage but awesome survivability as MT, incredible defensive utility as OT (Cover, Divine Veil, Stoneskin, Clemency) plus a raid defense buff (-strength down).

DRK brings good dps (some argue the best) and good survivability (with an edge in magic heavy fights) as MT, good dps as OT (unless you run into TP issues) and a raid defensive debuff (-INT down) and tentatively bring a second raid defensive debuff (-damage done) that requires rng and being hit to be available.

It just feels like one piece of the raid utility puzzle is missing from DRK.
I personally want to see Delerium get a DA effect that gives a +magic damage taken debuff. Wouldn't increase their own damage, but would help the party/raid.

IMO as far as raid utility, WAR should bring the extra offense/damage, PLD should bring the defense and DRK should bring more debuff to the party, then when they do the next tank class it can bring more direct buffs to the party (fingers crossed for Mystic Knight that can buff the party with enspell effects).

[OliviaBadger]

Yes that's true, I see what you mean. Perhaps they didn't want to make monk too strong and the go-to melee after it was so dominant in final coil. But, i dunno, everyone wants DRG now, so maybe delirium having blunt might be a good idea.

[BadRNG]

I'm not denying that but every serious end game raid party will always have a mnk meaning dragon kick will be up 100%

Why is this exactly? Or do you just mean world first groups, because in that case this whole argument is likely moot as the extreme min/maxers will probably not be bringing DRK to begin with.