If you could kill off one of the scions...

[jomoru]

I wouldn't say Minfilia gets kidnapped all the time, but she never lifts a finger in a combat situation despite being armed to do so. One of the first things we do for her is go get her knife inlaid with materia as an intro to the system, and she carries it with her on her right hip at all times. Despite this, she... never once uses it, even when she has every reason to do so.

Maybe it's for cheese?..

Its not her fault. Dancer hasn't been added to the game yet.

[Fenral]

I wouldn't say Minfilia gets kidnapped all the time, but she never lifts a finger in a combat situation despite being armed to do so. One of the first things we do for her is go get her knife inlaid with materia as an intro to the system, and she carries it with her on her right hip at all times. Despite this, she... never once uses it, even when she has every reason to do so.

You've seemed content in the past to argue against other items having any relevance as plants for future payoff. It was just a side trip to introduce the materia system, and it's done now. Does it need any other significance?

[Cilia]

snip

I understand that Minfilia isn't a fighter, but what does she do? (And what is that knife for?)

Manage the Scions? We already have Tataru as secretary, and Minfilia's "management" usually boils down to "dispatch the local Scion and the Warrior of Light to resolve a crisis."
Yes, you could argue that Thancred's possession was his own fault, but if Minfilia really was a proper manager, she'd know how to balance the needs of others against the needs of her people. Thancred overworked himself to help fill Louisoix's shoes, but as the manager Minfilia is responsible for looking after everyone and ensuring they're fit to go on missions. If they're overworked to exhaustion, they're liable to half-ass it or be killed in action, and then nobody else can be saved. Being a hero isn't all sugar and rainbows. Even if it's not a pleasant part of the job, sometimes sacrifices have to be made. You can't save everyone.

We didn't really need Minfilia to figure out how the Echo works, and to be honest we still understand only the barest of details about it. The Ascians do all kinds of things with the Echo we never dreamed possible (they're able to essentially break the rules of reality with it), so to say she "figured out the nature of the Echo" is giving her way too much credit.

Research? Ehh, I guess. Still, I thought that was more Urianger's job (and he's no slouch in combat, either). R&D is mostly Urianger and Moenbryda, respectively. Or was.

Are her managerial skills useful? Fo 'sho. ... but we never see her do any actual managing. Every time we go talk to her she's just standing behind her desk in the Solar. If she were really out there supervising research and such, she should be... you know... outside her room.

Not saying she should die or that I want to kill her, but I do not see the point in having 2.x Minfilia around (except for fanservice, but that's not a valid reason to me). I'd save her given the chance, and would be very happy if she came back in a more useful fashion at some point, but aside from exposition and as a figurehead I never felt 2.x Minfilia was all that important.

You've seemed content in the past to argue against other items having any relevance as plants for future payoff. It was just a side trip to introduce the materia system, and it's done now. Does it need any other significance?

It strictly doesn't, but the thing with the knife is that it's a Main Scenario Quest. Everyone has to do it at some point, so it is a 100% undeniable canon fact that Minfilia is armed, yet she does nothing to save her own damn self.

... rankles just a bit.

[LineageRazor]

Manage the Scions? We already have Tataru as secretary, and Minfilia's "management" usually boils down to "dispatch the local Scion and the Warrior of Light to resolve a crisis."

..yeah, that's pretty much what a Manager is SUPPOSED to do. A manager is given information, and assigns team members accordingly based on that information. In any place I've worked, a manager who gets directly involved on a project is a manager that simply gets in the way. No one can be good at everything (except maybe the Warrior of Light), and specialists often need someone who knows the big picture to let them know what they should be focusing on.

As far as actually killing off any Scions goes, I would definitely go with none. The only character I want to see dead right now is the obnoxious little snot who gives the new 52+ WHM quests. I think each of the Scions has their own charm and is quite multi-faceted, especially Thancred, and even Alphinaud can grow on you when you realize he's really doing very well given his age, and is still growing and learning.

Actually, I found Eschiva's attitude to be highly justified, and one that I've kinda shared myself when it comes to the Sennas. They've always talked about how Padjal must never leave the forest and how they always need to be available to listen to the Elementals and all that, but A-Towa-Cant, supposedly the greatest of all Padjal, wandered the world willy-nilly, and even Kann-E seems fine with visiting other cities or tracking down Moogles in the Mist. It really seemed inconsistent.

And, as it turned out, it was inconsistent because it was a LIE, albiet one that the younger Sennas seemed to believe, themselves. The Padjal aren't bound to stay within the forest, and so long as SOMEONE is around to interpret for the Elementals, a Padjal is free to go abroud, something A-Ruhn decides to do in the end. It was a convenient lie, since it was pretty clear that both of them were nervous about their first time out of the forest, but a lie nonetheless, so it's no wonder that Eschiva had little patience for their crap!

Man, if any job trainer needs to die, it's that Fray guy.

That's a joke. Since he's already dead. You can laugh, now.

[Cilia]

snip

The thing is, again, Minfilia's "management" usually boils down to "dispatch the local Scion(s) and the Warrior of Light to resolve a crisis." This implies she just throws the Scion who knows the area the best at the problem with the Warrior of Light as muscle. Primal issue in Ul'dah? Send Thancred! Primal issue in Limsa? Send Y'shtola! She then becomes nigh-irrelevant as Alphinaud takes over the diplomat role and instead of dispatching the local Scion the entire group is thrown at the problem (Leviathan, Ramuh, and Shiva).

Personally I don't think a manager is really necessary, at least not within the Scions. They're a small paramilitary group and the problems they need to resolve are often self-apparent, as is the person / people most suited to dealing with them. Again, Minfilia just dispatches the local Scion and the Warrior of Light - presumably because said Scion knows the region best, not because they're most competent at resolving the issue. Tellingly, instead of dispatching a Scion to help you with Moggle Mog, it's the Padjal who help you out. While the assignments with Thancred and Y'shtola do play to their strengths (subterfuge and "nature" magic respectively), that... could be a coincidence. Could be.

Don't kill Fray!

Aside from him being already dead, "Fray" is you, and the only person who seems to truly care about your well-being. When you really think about what that means and some of the things s/he said, it's almost heartbreaking.

[Kaiser-Ace]

Kidnapped twice is constantly now?

She left with Livia to prevent further casualtys (political prisoner 101) and Struggling againat Nebralius didn't really help her any since he (quite easily) over powered her. Which is not unacceptable considering he knocked us for a loop too when WE tried to stop him from taking her.

I hope Minfilia gets a motivation upgrade like Alphinode and Tataru and even hope she gets a power buff simmiler to Y'shtola when she comes back. How cool would it be of she's been getting her own crystals of light while she was MIA?

[Belhi]

I wouldn't say Minfilia gets kidnapped all the time, but she never lifts a finger in a combat situation despite being armed to do so. One of the first things we do for her is go get her knife inlaid with materia as an intro to the system, and she carries it with her on her right hip at all times. Despite this, she... never once uses it, even when she has every reason to do so.

Maybe it's for cheese?

Anyway, on paper her job is to manage the Scions, and before Alphinaud comes into the story she's the diplomat. But Alphinaud supplants her in that role, and even as a manager she utterly fails given Thancred overworked himself to the point he became vulnerable and got possessed by Lahabrea. In the end Minfilia's really just there to give you orders and for fanservice (have you seen the size of her knockers and the butt cleavage window?), and with someone else giving you orders in 3.0 (Alphinaud) she really feels superfluous at this point.

Now, could they bring her back and reenergize her character? Absolutely. But when freakin' Tataru is being more proactive in improving herself, you really have to wonder...

The knife I suspect was the knife Thancred gave her for her 18th birthday. It would fit. Regardless, she isn't a combatant. She hasn't been trained for that. In most combat situation she probably wouldn't be much more help than Tataru. Frankly people unskilled at combat are more likely go get in the way in tense melees.

I wouldn't call Thancred's possession her fault as manager. We see her trying to talk him round. He got so caught up himself that he left himself open. It was all his own fault, which he readily admits. However as manager she organises and plans most of the scions actions and in that the scions have operated admirably. Flow of information is co ordinated and quick, non-combatant personnel assigned guards, and personnel are sent quickly to respond to situations. Remember the Archons aren't the only Scions a lot of the time and there are non scion specialist performing research for the Scions. Who do you think organised all of that? Its not glamorous but its useful. People who underestimate the value of a good manager have never had a really bad one.

Ignoring that there has still been contributions by her. It was Minfilia in 2.2 that figured out the nature of the echo and its from that information that the method of destroying Ascians was inspired later after the observations of Ramuh's battle. She also assisted in the research on Shiva.

I suspect one of the reasons the Scions scattered in 2.55 was to facilitate character development by breaking them out of the set roles they had. We saw this in Alphinaud and Y'shtola. I expect we will see it for the rest. For Minfilia this holds a lot of potential. After all, out of all the Scions Minfilia has a lot of established back story and there is a lot not fleshed out there or left as plot threads unresolved. Consider the fact that Minfilia is a false identity, that she was hunted since the age of twelve by Garlean agents, that she survived to the age of 18 without leading anything.

How cool would it be of she's been getting her own crystals of light while she was MIA?

This is something I though was pretty major and could have implications. We know know that our crystal of light isn't the only one. So what does this mean? I think its interesting that

Elidibus says its time for 'you and yours to join the fray' to the Warrior of Darkness

Perhaps this could indicate that champions have 'satellite' allies. Where the champion has all the crystals and the blessing, others marked by Hydaelyn only have one. Perhaps we will see Minfilia/Ascilia get crystal.

[JeniLinsky]

Is it too late to say Alphinaud? 'cause I'd gleefully slit his throat with a broken bottle in a back alley, and make it look like a prostitution deal gone bad.

[PogueX]

Is it too late to say Alphinaud? 'cause I'd gleefully slit his throat with a broken bottle in a back alley, and make it look like a prostitution deal gone bad.

He's gotten better with the expansion, i am grateful that Tataru sewed him a new uniform to get rid of that skin tight outfit with high platform boots

[Cooperal]

If there had to be one, I'd like to see it be either Papalymo or Yda, with the survivor of the two becoming very altered, stoic and unpredictable as a result of the experience. Interesting idea but I've felt that these two have never stood out and aren't about to start now. Thancred and Y'shtola have always seemed a few steps above them in terms of limelight and plot importance. Even Urianger had more audience prior to 3.0 despite not guiding anyone during any of the starting-city prologues. I feel fairly confident in saying that either one of those two would be a stronger character without the other.

It's a jarring set up anyway. The Scions operate as a tight-knit group, like the protagonists guaranteed family. And then these two seem to skirt on the edge with an exclusive bond of their own. I felt like a colleague with everyone else. But as the game kept forcing the point of how Yda and Papalymo make a good team, I just feel myself third-wheeling it in their presence.

Thancred's circumstance seems a bit tough to decode. To my knowledge, Y'shtola used similar magic to Louisoix during her escape from Ul'dah. For this reason I assume that Thancred escaped from Ul'dah in a similar way to how the player escaped from Carteneau, not to reappear for some years. Though to him it might seem like a mere moment, if he's not lost his memory entirely. If that's the case he will probably come back fine way further down once he reappears in the world and someone recognises him. Though on the other hand, maybe he will emerge not only without memory, but is also reincarnated with a changed appearance to emulate the way people couldn't remember what the WoL looked like either.

But now I know I'm blurring lines. Nobody said the WoL teleportation was made possible just because he/she was a WoL, but people do say the WoL was labelled as such because it's all they see when trying to recall their appearance (but if that was the case it would seem like a coincidence that Hydaelyn too uses this term).

Sorry for going so far off track. I'm mixing "who I want dead" with "what would be interesting for all the Scions we haven't found yet".