Speed Runs Suck

[Malevicton]

Yes, let's forget about respecting someone who doesn't feel secure with speedrunning a dungeon just because it's "efficient". Never forget you are on the Duty Finder, and the sole purpose of Duty Finder isn't giving you tomestones, it's making old players help new players.

There's no "sole purpose". There's no demographic more important than the other. DF is there to put people into groups. That's it. What happens after that is the group's business, but SE didn't give some transcendental authority to any specific type of behavior.

[Twilite]

Both of you don't know the reasons SE implemented DF despite any reason seemingly being obvious.

[Makeda]

When I go on my DPS alt I will often pull something the tank skipped and kite it onto the tank... IF I think my DPS is enough to take it down before everyone's resources get low :P

When I go as a tank, I'll only skip a room if it has no treasure path, or if it seems obvious that people are hitting 'pass' on gear for their class... If the group is eating through stuff like a hot knife in butter, I won't skip things, even things with no loot, because they're making the time/XP ratio worth it.

[Noira]

If you do this then you are a bad tank plain and simple, tanks role is to adapt and carry the group if it comes to that. I know its sometimes annoying when whole group makes your job total nightmare, so you should take it as an combat training for end-game because nothing is better training than running dungeons with tards. ^^

PS: I love when caster/healer pop sprit and grabs extra pack from further ahead so i can slack and stand still.

Come on...don't lie..come on be honest..

You and I both know there is no combat training for endgame that requires a dps or healer to pull mobs ahead of the tank and for you as a tank to save them. Those endgame game mobs hit so damn hard the dps and healer will be dead before you even provoke.

We called that a wipe or potential wipe.

[Drtoxicmedica]

Good example of why I don't go blazing through multiple mobs right off the bat but instead gauge dps is the first double pull you can do in sohm al. Pulling that and not having the dps for it is just obnoxious. I usually do a small or moderate pull first to gauge df dps. IThe first set of adds in factual and neverreap will be pulled by themselves (I'll throw the moth in there if it happens to be close) if a dps automatically decides they wanna pull then next set I'll just let them die and respawn. I'm not playing pick the mobs of the dps. It's just not smart to go full speed run of the bat so many things can go wrong. If the group works quickly on that first set and shows the ability to keep up a fast pass needing little down time. it's speed run time. This is purely to allow a balance. I only ask for 1 pull to see where the groups stands as far as experience is concerned. If your to trigger happy to handle that you need take a break from the game and relax a little

[Iagainsti]

I'll admit, I try to speed run content I haven't tried before. It's less about the time crunch for me as it is to testing my warrior skills to the limit, like, "can my cd combos hold up 4 packs in this run?". If we wipe, I'll apologize and tame the beast within. How big a deal is a wipe or two really?, and the ppl that get so #butthurt they #ragequit are the loons I don't really want to run with anyway.

[Iagainsti]

On the note of dps pulls, the only other mmo I've played is ffxi, where dps actually pulled to the party(positioning was important) so that doesn't bother me, I have no prob grabbing adds. What drives me nuts are ppl who get agggro and run around like maniacs; you're messing up my rotation homes chasing you down. Pro tip: gain aggro, run to the tank.

[Neophyte]

On the note of dps pulls, the only other mmo I've played is ffxi, where dps actually pulled to the party(positioning was important) so that doesn't bother me, I have no prob grabbing adds. What drives me nuts are ppl who get agggro and run around like maniacs; you're messing up my rotation homes chasing you down. Pro tip: gain aggro, run to the tank.

Exactly... if a tank holds aggro on 3 mobs and I pull the 4th (happend yesterday in Wanderer's palace with a single Tomberry, which was 5m away) and stack it on the tank.... than it's way more effort to not take it off of me. xD

And what exactly do ppl think to achieve by letting a dps die to an intentional pull on a single mob? Teach him a lessen, waste time? Great... maybe the dps teaches them a lesson in return by not attacking solo-adds which could be taken into his pull.
That's especially great for the two other ppl not involved, two divas who want to teach other lessons.. one letting the dps die (healer will jump in joy to be forced to turn CS off, just 'cause tank want to teach dps a lesson)... the other one not attacking and slowing the run further down.

It just shakes me, if I DoT+Contagion a pull and there's this solo-add which gets ignored by tank and stand like 5m away. Can't count the times when the Druid/healer in Fractal got totally ignored by the tank... usually I aggro it (DoTs+Fester), pull it LoS to the tank and Bane+PF.

[Noira]

Exactly... if a tank holds aggro on 3 mobs and I pull the 4th (happend yesterday in Wanderer's palace with a single Tomberry, which was 5m away) and stack it on the tank.... than it's way more effort to not take it off of me. xD.

You aren't the type of dps we are talking about though.

That's the "helping the tank out" dps.

We're talking about the type that run off and brings back a big mob with him/her and expect you to pull them off.

I have no qualms with your type. Sometimes I'll be too busy gaining aggro on the first set and trying not to keep moving so it's helpul for a dps to pull them closer.

[BroodingFicus]

Speed runs make we want to stop healing. Not the speed runs where everyone is geared and you have amazing dps that can burn the pulls. No. That's fine but not the norm in my experience.

The runs I am talking about are ones where you find yourself (as I just did) almost oom every pull in Neverreap because you are staring at a half law half esoteric geared PLD, who somehow has only 500 more life than the two BLM's in your party, that is trying to speed run and just expects you to keep him alive. Then has the nerve at the end to 'GREAT RUN ' at me. I'm still trying to figure out how his HP pool was so low when his gear was that high but whatever the case he had no business speed running anything but that sure didn't stop him. The general feel I get in these runs is that the tank doesn't care if I have to burn benediction, tetra, and all my cool downs to keep them on their feet. So long as they don't die its a 'GOOD RUN '. Its not a good run. Its stressful, often slower if the dps involved don't have great aoe damage or the tank can't hold aggro, and it encourages your healer to watch you die just for the momentary satisfaction of seeing your health bar at 0. It doesn't prove you are a good tank. It feels like some strange pissing contest that the other three party members are simply drug along for because someone has to be there to hold the fans so that the tank can stand heroically in the aftermath. I tanked before I healed and frankly I never did speed runs on anything but Bray hard and only usually if I had a friend heal for me and knew the dps could take it. As healer I am not amused by the people already trying to speed run the newer dungeons. Especially the ones who can't be smart about it.

*closes rant*