Speed Runs Suck

[Dualblade]

No. They are telling you that the group can handle more and you should do your part in that endeavor. I'm sure you would never understand that though because of the ego and general "I showed them by letting them die" attitude involved in that line of thinking.

And if the group wipes because the DPS did so and the tank did actually take the mobs, trying to do their job when others are going out of their way to mess it up? Yes sometimes the group can handle it, but not always. I like tanking, more so bosses then mobs and such situations have happened where DPS pulls extra mobs and gets us killed.

[Rocond]

And if the group wipes because the DPS did so and the tank did actually take the mobs, trying to do their job when others are going out of their way to mess it up? Yes sometimes the group can handle it, but not always. I like tanking, more so bosses then mobs and such situations have happened where DPS pulls extra mobs and gets us killed.

You should read my first post then where I already said that is another story if they can't handle it. The point was you should at least put in the effort first to find that out rather than just let them die.

[Viridiana]

No. They are telling you that the group can handle more and you should do your part in that endeavor. I'm sure you would never understand that though because of the ego and general "I showed them by letting them die" attitude involved in that line of thinking.

The proper way to try to get someone to go faster is to ask, not to usurp their role. For the record, though, I don't have an ego when I tank, or when I heal. I know that I'm not stellar at either of them. But I am a good DPS, and I know that as a DPS you do not call up what you can not put down.

[Rocond]

The proper way to try to get someone to go faster is to ask, not to usurp their role. For the record, though, I don't have an ego when I tank, or when I heal. I know that I'm not stellar at either of them. But I am a good DPS, and I know that as a DPS you do not call up what you can not put down.

Whether or not you feel like you have an ego is whatever. I don't care. I'll let you feel however about that, but letting someone die on purpose because they didn't follow how you think the dungeon should go is an egotistical thing to do. There are no set rules on the way it should go and everyone should adapt to what's going on. Even if you think it's wrong the dps or healer grabbed some extra mobs, it's just as wrong to stop doing your job at that point beause you feel you're the important one to teach them a lesson.

I'll just leave it that. I think I made my point regardless of who agrees and who doesn't.

[Neophyte]

If I'm tanking and the DPS deliberately pulls another group of mobs, they're telling me that they want to do my job. I'll let them until they die. If the healer for some reason heals them, I'll make sure the mobs don't go for the healer, but I won't pull mobs off of someone who deliberately pulled mobs to themselves, just like I wouldn't fight for aggro with an off tank.

If the tanks's not dropping under 80% without CDs, a fairy is the only one healing and the tank refuses to take 1 or 2 more mobs.. I mean someone has to do the job.

[Fevelle]

If the tanks's not dropping under 80% without CDs, a fairy is the only one healing and the tank refuses to take 1 or 2 more mobs.. I mean someone has to do the job.

Yes, and since you pulled 1 or 2 more mobs you better tank them.
I'm a healer, and I'll only heal a DPS who deliberately pulled more mobs after the fight with the mobs pulled by the tank is over, so I hope you can manage them alone for 1-2 minutes.

[Neophyte]

Yes, and since you pulled 1 or 2 more mobs you better tank them.
I'm a healer, and I'll only heal a DPS who deliberately pulled more mobs after the fight with the mobs pulled by the tank is over, so I hope you can manage them alone for 1-2 minutes.

Then i'll dot them, stun or push'em away, tribind them, virus them, heal myself or just pull out Titan Egi and tank myself. No problem. Or i pull the extramob into the group and finish both tankmobs with painflare/deathflare, then you may have time for healz?
SCH fairy is healing me whatever i do (if healer not saying her to not do anything) so i just stick around her.
I did every dungeon (2.x) synched with 4 SMN, so i know how long i can 'tank' and to handle my skills that save me in such situations.

@Viridiana: No ones talking about a group without any AoE-class. But SCH and SMN do more dmg the more mobs are there, with additional use of Eye for an Eye, which you won't use on unrisky 2mob-pulls. One Bio (or think of trisaster) at a additional mob grants way more dps than an additional ruin on the single target does.
The hate generated by DoTs is minimal and me standing next to tank makes it easy for him to just switch target.

As a tank (or player at all) you have to know what different classes are capable of... If you got an add left with 10% health and 5 DoTs running.. just go on.
If you're struggling with mobs, dont pull more.
If you're doing fine (healer dpsing and tank not dropping health) then it's just fine if you try something out.
I dont see any reason for letting a player die, if [i]everything[\i] runs fine and only thing is that i'm 'forced' to do little more than minimum effort.

I play healer myself sometimes and i would never ever give someone no heals just for 'punishing' him.
What's next, not healing a tank on purpose who use too less CDs to teach'em that you as a healer decide how much health everyone has to lose at max?
Probably only not doing it, cuz u would be next one dying.

After all it helps me to become a better healer, if i can react on such stuff (like in A2 it often happens that a dps gets initial aggro on a mob).
And i will never let someone die who does accidentially facepull (maybe out of my sight) and i think he did it on purpose, which may happen to healers like you.

[Viridiana]

If the tanks's not dropping under 80% without CDs, a fairy is the only one healing and the tank refuses to take 1 or 2 more mobs.. I mean someone has to do the job.

Well, no, no one has to pull for the tank. I mean, if the fairy is the only one healing, we have 3 DPS now, because the SCH is outputting DPS, right? Or is the healer afk? If the SCH is doing DPS, it's probably going to take more than one or two more mobs for switch to AOE from the DPS at the expense of 3 people doing single-target. The time it would take for a DPS to run out and grab at least 2 more groups could be better spent actually killing mobs so the group can move on to the next pull as a whole. If the SCH is afk because the fairy can solo heal, then pulling more groups might get the party killed.

I'm not saying that the run couldn't go faster, but having the BRD run over and pull 3 more enemies for the tank to handle most likely isn't the way to do it.

[Synestra]

If I'm tanking and the DPS deliberately pulls another group of mobs, they're telling me that they want to do my job. I'll let them until they die. If the healer for some reason heals them, I'll make sure the mobs don't go for the healer, but I won't pull mobs off of someone who deliberately pulled mobs to themselves, just like I wouldn't fight for aggro with an off tank.

If you do this then you are a bad tank plain and simple, tanks role is to adapt and carry the group if it comes to that. I know its sometimes annoying when whole group makes your job total nightmare, so you should take it as an combat training for end-game because nothing is better training than running dungeons with tards. ^^

PS: I love when caster/healer pop sprit and grabs extra pack from further ahead so i can slack and stand still.

[Noira]

If you do this then you are a bad tank plain and simple, tanks role is to adapt and carry the group if it comes to that. I know its sometimes annoying when whole group makes your job total nightmare, so you should take it as an combat training for end-game because nothing is better training than running dungeons with tards. ^^

PS: I love when caster/healer pop sprit and grabs extra pack from further ahead so i can slack and stand still.

Come on...don't lie..come on be honest..

You and I both know there is no combat training for endgame that requires a dps or healer to pull mobs ahead of the tank and for you as a tank to save them. Those endgame game mobs hit so damn hard the dps and healer will be dead before you even provoke.

We called that a wipe or potential wipe.