Is Selene all that?

[Tillen]

No Way! Scholars do your math! My recast is 2.43, with Selene's buff it is 2.35, that is .08 seconds faster. Times 12 (2.5[GCD] timer x 12 = 30[duration of buff]), = .96. You earn 1 second every time Selene uses her little 3%. Given a 5 minute, I can use it five times. That's 2 extra skills ( 5 seconds earned x 2.5 GCD) in a 5 minute fight. I timed auto-attacks on a dummy and earned roughly the same, .07 seconds between hits. Lets assume the same math for simplicity sake that's 2 extra hits in a 5 minute fight. Now lets multiply by 8 people that's 16 extra skills and 16 extra hits in a 5 minute fight. (No It doesn't work on everything, look at Selene, her Embrace stays at 2.00 cast time, with or without buff). With old Selene, my cooldowns went to 2.28 from 2.43! Nerf!

Now, let's turn on Eos, 20% magic damage mitigation, Adlo the tank, Deployment tactics. Switch to cleric stance and tell me you can't get in 16 skills and 16 hits in one rotation while Eos does her thing.

[Tillen]

I will say, Esuna AoE, is nice if you don't have the time and you are in a specific fight. But half of the important debuffs can't be Leeched anyway. Selene got straight nerfed. I'll use her from time to time, to make myself feel better. But Eos is the go to fairy, unless you know there is a fight where a raid/party wide debuff is coming and can be debuffed.

I will say this scales. I was in a dungeon and level synced, and had 2.37 recast, it went down to 2.30. When I went from 2.43 to 2.35, I was level 56, with 484 Spell Speed. So test it on your DPS friends and report back with numbers!

[GideonHighmourn]

No Way! Scholars do your math!

You're forgetting that Selene's Fey Wind affects the entire group, and also increases Auto-Attack speed (which is significant for some classes).

There's never been a time I've needed Whispering Wind+Fey Illumination in the current content.

[dragoelete]

honestly i preferred the original selene buffs over the new one... the new one fells like to much of a decrease in over all dmg i don't care if it increases auto attack speed it still doesn't match (nor come close to) the sheer amount of dmg the previous buff would allow you to do... especially if you were in a 8 person party.

[Tillen]

[QUOTE=GideonHighmourn;3123044]You're forgetting that Selene's Fey Wind affects the entire group, and also increases Auto-Attack speed (which is significant for some classes).

No, read the math again. That's 16 TOTAL extra skills/spells and 16 extra auto-attacks for the whole party in 5 mins. 2 each per member, every 5 minutes. Assuming a 2.43 cool down without buff. Any haste is great, but compared to additional damage mitigation and healing buff. Selenes buff is just negligible help. It's just the hype train cause its a new skill. But the proof is in the math.

[Ghishlain]

No Way! Scholars do your math! My recast is 2.43, with Selene's buff it is 2.35, that is .08 seconds faster. Times 12 (2.5[GCD] timer x 12 = 30[duration of buff]), = .96. You earn 1 second every time Selene uses her little 3%. Given a 5 minute, I can use it five times. That's 2 extra skills ( 5 seconds earned x 2.5 GCD) in a 5 minute fight. I timed auto-attacks on a dummy and earned roughly the same, .07 seconds between hits. Lets assume the same math for simplicity sake that's 2 extra hits in a 5 minute fight. Now lets multiply by 8 people that's 16 extra skills and 16 extra hits in a 5 minute fight. (No It doesn't work on everything, look at Selene, her Embrace stays at 2.00 cast time, with or without buff). With old Selene, my cooldowns went to 2.28 from 2.43! Nerf!

Now, let's turn on Eos, 20% magic damage mitigation, Adlo the tank, Deployment tactics. Switch to cleric stance and tell me you can't get in 16 skills and 16 hits in one rotation while Eos does her thing.

I think I'm gonna counter that your math is incomplete

Fey Glow - For Magical Damage Users
Normal - 2.43s GCD = 30s / 2.43 GCD = 12.36 actions / 30 seconds
Fey Wind - 2.36 GCD = 30s / 2.36 GCD = 12.71 actions / 30 seconds <<<< 0.35 additional actions per 30 seconds
Fey Glow - 2.28 GCD = 30s / 2.28GCD = 13.15 actions / 30 seconds <<<< 0.79 additional actions per 30 seconds

This makes sense. It's pretty clear that Fey Glow does better for a caster in its previous iteration.

However, take into account that we don't know (at least I personally haven't seen) what the new Spell Speed curve looks like at level 60. 30% additional Spell Speed at the current base line may not give you that 0.15 faster GCD because the curve may have dramatically changed. For all we know, 30% additional Spell Speed at this level only equates to only reducing your GCD to 2.36s.

Also, what you're doing is comparing a level 50 SCH with i110-i130 gear to a level 60 SCH with i180 gear (which is the equivalent of a level 50 SCH with i70 gear). Spell Speed boosts get a lot better as you continue to stack Spell Speed (30% at 350 SpS = +105 SpS versus 30% on 450 SpS = +135 SpS) on your gear. This endeavor becomes easier at higher gear levels. This means that SpS at the current level of gear will mean less to the casters versus what they meant to a higher ilvl caster back at 50.

Now, let's look at Fey Light, the Skill Speed boost

Fey Light - For Physical Damage Users

I'm going to assume all melee have the same 2.5 GCD just for easy math.

Normal - 2.43s GCD = 30s / 2.43 GCD = 12.36 actions / 30 seconds
Fey Wind - 2.36 GCD = 30s / 2.36 GCD = 12.71 actions / 30 seconds <<<< 0.35 additional actions per 30 seconds
Fey Light - 2.28 GCD = 30s / 2.28GCD = 13.15 actions / 30 seconds <<<< 0.79 additional actions per 30 seconds

Now remember, Fey Light only affected your Skill Speed and thus your Weaponskills. This means Fey Light @ level 50 granted your physical DPS 12.36 auto attacks + 13.15 GCDs = 25.51 "attacks" per 30 seconds.

However, now that Fey Wind gives you both increased auto attacks that gives you 12.71 auto attacks + 12.71 GCDs = 25.42 "attacks" per 30 seconds.

Again, this means Fey Light is better on paper - when you consider level 50.

My friend is a WAR and we were trying to see how much SkS it takes to get a 9-hit Berserk going. At level 50, you needed approximately 370-390 SkS to hit that 9-hit mark. My friend now needs approximately 550 SkS at level 60 to get that 9-hit mark. The curve has most certainly changed to suit the gear inflation and until we have more definitive answer, I will again say for again, for all we know 30% additional SkS will equates to reducing your GCD to 2.36s.

Likewise, I will reiterate my gear argument here too.

=====

Based on the above, the 3% Haste in my mind looks about the same as the 30% SkS and 30% SpS buff you'd get in alternating way - but that's just an objective observation without knowing all the facts of how stats have been changed. Certain classes (namely physical melee classes) will be able to make use of Fey Wind much better than casters / WM BRD / GB MCN due to the way it works, but it feels like S-E hit the mark with the conversion from Fey Light / Glow to Fey Wind.

Now, if you wanted to argue Eos versus Selene, here are my two cents.

Selene provides a raid DPS increase of ~1.5% due to the nature of Haste. In order for Eos to be better from a rDPS standpoint, she has to provide enough healing capacity to allow for the Scholar to DPS harder, and that Scholar must be able to account for at least 1.5% rDPS increase by switching from Selene to Eos. The math is much more complicated than that but this simplified model serves to illustrate my point easily enough.

Which then leads to my next point - Selene healing is "enough healing" to get through the content, why would you bother to use Eos who adds nothing beneficial to your or your party's DPS when Selene can keep your party healthy AND provide additional party DPS via buffs. This is one of a few questions Scholars should ask themselves when considering what Fairy they should be using.

[Sidra]

Which then leads to my next point - Selene healing is "enough healing" to get through the content, why would you bother to use Eos who adds nothing beneficial to your or your party's DPS when Selene can keep your party healthy AND provide additional party DPS via buffs. This is one of a few questions Scholars should ask themselves when considering what Fairy they should be using.

4 person Dungeon - Whispering Dawn at pull. WD heals for the equivalent of 2 Physiks - which saved me 2 GCDs before I have to pop out of CS to heal. Thats 2 Broils, which is more than Selene's buff would have added to the pull. Next pull, Fey Illumination (Selene's would have been down) - that extra healing power saves me 1 GCD to heal - 1 Broil - Selene would have added nothing that pull.

That's why EOS is superior for 4 person dungeons, assuming the SCH is DPSing.

[Ghishlain]

4 person Dungeon - Whispering Dawn at pull. WD heals for the equivalent of 2 Physiks - which saved me 2 GCDs before I have to pup out of CS to heal. Thats 2 Broils, which is more than Selene's buff would have added to the pull. Next pull, Fey Illumination (Selene's would have been down) - that extra healing power saves me 1 GCD to heal - 1 Broil - Selene would have added nothing that pull.

That's why EOS is superior for 4 person dungeons, assuming the SCH is DPSing.

And this is the kind of thought process Scholar's should be employing when considering their fairy selection.

Likewise, if gear scores got to a point where Selene w/ Rouse could heal every pull without additional assistance, then you pick Selene and get the DPS boost while maintaining your normal DPS without missing a beat.

[Sidra]

Correct.

The addition of Broil swung this in Eos' favor with current gear/dungeon clear speed. Assuming with either Fairy you have time to get dots up, in 2.0 you were using Ruin (some maybe BlizzII but I always preferred to just focus a single target down after my dots were up) so the comparative DPS it was adding to the SCH was much less than it is now with a real nuke.

[Wizarus]

MP is also more of an issue in Heavensward. Not that it will mean much if you're just healing and nothing else, but if you're in CS, that MP drain from DPS is now very noticabable. All 3 of Eos skills means you are saving MP to use elsewhere.

Aldo, Emergency Tactics Aldo, Aldo, CS into DPS takes a huge chunk out of the MP for example.