What's missing from quests: Decisions and variation

[Cycloptichorn]

Over the weekend, I got to thinking about the setup of side-quests in this game. I like the number of them; there certainly are a lot to do. But they seem to only come in two types: kill quests and fetch quests. "Go kill this for me, or go ask this guy a question and come back." That's about it.

I'd like to see some greater variation, and I think there are a few pretty easy ways to make this happen:

1. Decision points. Currently, for pretty much every quest, you make no decisions whatsoever. There's no input from the player, other than to decide to do the quest or not. Wouldn't it be a lot more interesting if you were asked to make a choice? For example: do you help the Gyshal Greens farmer get rid of the wolves that are nearby by killing them, or by synthing some lumber and a hammer so he can build a fence? Do you tell the lonely wife that her husband is drinking it up with some wench at the Adventurer's guild, or lie and tell her that he's off working in the fields (for a handsome reward)? Giving the player an opportunity to make choices is a very simple way to add a lot of variation and meaning to quests, without adding anything difficult to program at all.

2. Random rewards. Not every quest should tell you what the reward is for completing it! And what more, adding a random element - with some very nice pieces thrown in at a low drop rate - would help increase enjoyment and excitement for quests.

3. Branching quest lines. This goes along with #1 - it would be pretty easy to make the decisions we make in quests meaningful, by having them lead to branching quest lines. Once again, this can't be all that hard to program; it's just a matter of writing the script. Having several quests that lead up to a major reward is great content, much better than tons of tiny quests that don't lead up to anything at all, other than a little SP and some food that you don't want.

4. Non-sp or item quest rewards. Quests could easily lead to the opening of new areas or new buildings in towns, available only to those who have actually accomplished the quests correctly.

5. Time limits!! More quests need to be popped with a certain time limit once you begin them. I was rocking it through toto-rak the other day, and one of the best features of the place is the time limit. It adds a real sense of urgency to whatever you're doing when you are timed. And the limits don't have to be drop-dead, make-the-limit or you fail the quest; there could be bonuses or rewards for doing them quickly, and only the base reward for doing them slowly.

6. New types of quests. We certainly could have more variation in the types of activities we're asked to accomplish. Here are just a few that I thought up in the last few minutes:

- Foot races vs. a speedy Lala NPC
- Crafting races versus journeyman NPC crafters - who can make 20 iron rings faster?
- Market ward/where's Waldo quests: who can find the hidden NPC with a free reward fastest?
- Town/Where's Waldo quests: not just in the wards, either. There's a thief in town, where is he hiding?
- Parley tournament/training. Lots of people don't like Parley, I do. Give us a method for improving our skills and practicing Parley!
- Mob outbreak in town! - A group of Gnarly Gnomes has tunneled into the basement of Ul'Dah! Convince them to leave, fight them, or trade items with them!
- Secret Beastcoin shop quest - it would be a good way to get some use out of these things. A tall man in a hood steps out of the shadows; you think, a Roegadyn? But no, it's an Ixali who has been exiled from his tribe until he can bring back a whole lot of money to pay for the bride he stole from the next village. Fortunately, he's got some great armor and potions for sale...
- Help mages create new spells - I'd like to see quests that require items. A lot of items. Not 'fetch me 12 cotton balls.' A whole list of different things that are hard to get. With rewards to match: Clusters, high-level crafting mats, nice weapons or armor, or - hopefully - new spells.
- Scouting missions - The Garleans are coming, right? Well; how many of them are coming? We need to know! It would be fun to have missions that required the char to go find a camp of the enemy and COUNT - not fight - a random number of enemies, of different types, and have to report back how many they found. Good company quest there.
- Name card exchange - sort of a 'get-to-know' each other quest. Give every player an item (a name card) which they can trade to another player for one of their cards. Each time it's traded to someone new, you get a stamp on it. Turn in a card with 50 stamps to receive a prize!
- The lonely Biast. I'd like a quest that looks like a normal quest - go kill this mob, etc - but when you get the mob down to almost no life, it surrenders! And explains to you that it has a sick kid and is only rampaging because it doesn't know what to do to heal it. Mages could follow the mob to the den and cast spells, fighters could use potions, crafters could, I dunno, build some crap for the nest so it won't be so windy.
- Gathering -> battle quests! We've all heard the story of the guy who went fishing, and caught something a hell of a lot bigger than he was bargaining for. We could have the same thing - cutting down a tree? Forest spirit doesn't like that! Mining? Oh noez, you broke into a cave full of jellies who are now pissed!

And finally, what I'd really like to see:

- Cross-job or class quests. Quests which REQUIRE you to have several different high-level jobs to even pop, and ask you to use all those skills if you want the best reward. For example; a Highlander in Ul'Dah is a huge collector of original artwork. But he only likes items created FROM SCRATCH by one person - no group stuff for him! You might have to have an r30 DoM or DoW, an r30 DoH and r30 DoL to even pop the quest, and it could require you to gather the mats from very dangerous areas - several of them - and create the items requested (With a special recipe!) yourself.

All these seem pretty achieveable - they all rely for the most part of existing game mechanics - but would provide a much greater level of detail and immersion than the current, bland side quests.

I hope you will consider thumbing this post up if you agree, or providing your commentary on whether or not these are ideas worth implementing.

Cheers
The Cyclops

[Eekiki]

1. Decision points. Currently, for pretty much every quest, you make no decisions whatsoever. There's no input from the player, other than to decide to do the quest or not. Wouldn't it be a lot more interesting if you were asked to make a choice? For example: do you help the Gyshal Greens farmer get rid of the wolves that are nearby by killing them, or by synthing some lumber and a hammer so he can build a fence? Do you tell the lonely wife that her husband is drinking it up with some wench at the Adventurer's guild, or lie and tell her that he's off working in the fields (for a handsome reward)? Giving the player an opportunity to make choices is a very simple way to add a lot of variation and meaning to quests, without adding anything difficult to program at all.

Agreed, and especially since this was already done in this game* I don't see why it can't be done more.

* The mission where you have to meet with the Amal'jaa (I forget what rank it is) and you are given the choice to either kill them or play Parley with them.

2. Random rewards. Not every quest should tell you what the reward is for completing it! And what more, adding a random element - with some very nice pieces thrown in at a low drop rate - would help increase enjoyment and excitement for quests.

Meh...drops from bosses and NMs are already good enough here.

3. Branching quest lines. This goes along with #1 - it would be pretty easy to make the decisions we make in quests meaningful, by having them lead to branching quest lines. Once again, this can't be all that hard to program; it's just a matter of writing the script. Having several quests that lead up to a major reward is great content, much better than tons of tiny quests that don't lead up to anything at all, other than a little SP and some food that you don't want.

Also good. There's a decided lack of consequences in the ol' MMORPG genre.

4. Non-sp or item quest rewards. Quests could easily lead to the opening of new areas or new buildings in towns, available only to those who have actually accomplished the quests correctly.

Excellent idea.

5. Time limits!! More quests need to be popped with a certain time limit once you begin them. I was rocking it through toto-rak the other day, and one of the best features of the place is the time limit. It adds a real sense of urgency to whatever you're doing when you are timed. And the limits don't have to be drop-dead, make-the-limit or you fail the quest; there could be bonuses or rewards for doing them quickly, and only the base reward for doing them slowly.

Yes and no. I'd rather it be like what you said in the last sentence, where exceeding the time limit doesn't mean you fail, it only means you don't get the best rewards.

6. New types of quests. We certainly could have more variation in the types of activities we're asked to accomplish. Here are just a few that I thought up in the last few minutes:

- Foot races vs. a speedy Lala NPC
- Crafting races versus journeyman NPC crafters - who can make 20 iron rings faster?
- Market ward/where's Waldo quests: who can find the hidden NPC with a free reward fastest?
- Town/Where's Waldo quests: not just in the wards, either. There's a thief in town, where is he hiding?
- Parley tournament/training. Lots of people don't like Parley, I do. Give us a method for improving our skills and practicing Parley!
- Mob outbreak in town! - A group of Gnarly Gnomes has tunneled into the basement of Ul'Dah! Convince them to leave, fight them, or trade items with them!
- Secret Beastcoin shop quest - it would be a good way to get some use out of these things. A tall man in a hood steps out of the shadows; you think, a Roegadyn? But no, it's an Ixali who has been exiled from his tribe until he can bring back a whole lot of money to pay for the bride he stole from the next village. Fortunately, he's got some great armor and potions for sale...
- Help mages create new spells - I'd like to see quests that require items. A lot of items. Not 'fetch me 12 cotton balls.' A whole list of different things that are hard to get. With rewards to match: Clusters, high-level crafting mats, nice weapons or armor, or - hopefully - new spells.
- Scouting missions - The Garleans are coming, right? Well; how many of them are coming? We need to know! It would be fun to have missions that required the char to go find a camp of the enemy and COUNT - not fight - a random number of enemies, of different types, and have to report back how many they found. Good company quest there.
- Name card exchange - sort of a 'get-to-know' each other quest. Give every player an item (a name card) which they can trade to another player for one of their cards. Each time it's traded to someone new, you get a stamp on it. Turn in a card with 50 stamps to receive a prize!
- The lonely Biast. I'd like a quest that looks like a normal quest - go kill this mob, etc - but when you get the mob down to almost no life, it surrenders! And explains to you that it has a sick kid and is only rampaging because it doesn't know what to do to heal it. Mages could follow the mob to the den and cast spells, fighters could use potions, crafters could, I dunno, build some crap for the nest so it won't be so windy.
- Gathering -> battle quests! We've all heard the story of the guy who went fishing, and caught something a hell of a lot bigger than he was bargaining for. We could have the same thing - cutting down a tree? Forest spirit doesn't like that! Mining? Oh noez, you broke into a cave full of jellies who are now pissed!

Goes without saying. I don't think anyone would argue that making every quest be "kill X rabbits" is boring.

- Cross-job or class quests. Quests which REQUIRE you to have several different high-level jobs to even pop, and ask you to use all those skills if you want the best reward. For example; a Highlander in Ul'Dah is a huge collector of original artwork. But he only likes items created FROM SCRATCH by one person - no group stuff for him! You might have to have an r30 DoM or DoW, an r30 DoH and r30 DoL to even pop the quest, and it could require you to gather the mats from very dangerous areas - several of them - and create the items requested (With a special recipe!) yourself.

I hate crafting, but I do like the idea of having to craft something in order to complete a DoW/M quest.

[Gramul]

I need more like buttons.

I remember FFXI had all sorts of quests, and most of them where dynamically integrated into the game world. You didn't have to go to one specific spot to be issued one specific type of quest. I mean, that does have its advantages for grinding. But we need more side quests that don't just revolve around go here and kill X of Y. That would be a true expansion of game lore. In FFXI, you delivered water to tombstones, grew flowers, and reunited an elvaan boy with his father (though the father wasn't particularly happy about it as I recall).

[Ark_mage2]

Completely agree with everything except the notion of a timed quest. Maybe for certain quests having it be time-based for a part of it... but to arbitrarily limit the time for a quest seems kinda unfair.

Hopefully this is the kind of thing we will be getting soon. Yoshi-P did say that starting with 1.21 there will be fewer quests being added, but each quest would start becoming a lot more involved and story driven. Here's hoping that is the case.

[Anima]

All are great Ideas! and It's practically Spot on lol, Quest needs moar {Fun}!
+1
Edit: I support this 100% people wants to know why are quests here, why should they do it, what's the benefit, is it interesting?