Ways to fix BRD and MCH in a realistic way

[Dante_V]

I don't think the op is really a "realistic" way at all. Not necessarily a bad idea but if realistic is what you are going for then Bards wouldn't be moving at all while shooting. As someone who has shot many bow IRL I can tell you that you aren't going to be running around shooting arrows to any real effective or accurate degree. If they added realism to it then it would be more like WM damage 100% of the time with a 50% accuracy loss while moving. Arrows don't gain damage by standing still, the point of standing is for accuracy. You could argue that the increase in accuracy allows for a more critical arrow placement leading to more damage and I would agree however there would be a huge accuracy decrease while moving that would result in less damage overall.

[Yellow]

Bards in Final Fantasy have been a job that have low damage output due to the utility they can provide with their songs. I think as a DPS class in 14, the class needs to revolve around managing songs to improve your party while having enough output of DPS to be somewhat relevant in the party. The balance needs to be how much utility they provide in order to make up for their lack of damage.

I think that while Bard should be more on the utility side, Machinist should be more towards the DPS side with less party utility (perhaps more solo utility, situational improvements, etc).

Remember that this is a Final Fantasy game.. if you want a ranged DPS then perhaps you want a Hunter job, rather than Bard...

[Volgera]

SE, just remove Empyreal Arrow and Iron Jaw from WM and we are set!!! :P

If someone want extra 20% damage just turn WM on!!

[Xyth]

I rarely ever need to use Ballad or Paeon Pre-3.0. If players played and manage their mana and TP usage, on top of their Shroud/Aetherflow/Invig, the songs are never needed to be played. The ONLY time I used ballad is when a fight extends longer than it should (which happens occasionally in a pug group with low DPS), or when a healer dies and ressed.

In most fights, that excludes BRDs, let's say 2 Melee or caster + Melee, can be completed without any issue. The BRD's utility is a bonus when it comes to our class, and I agree that it's a trump card. It's not necessary to use, but it's there when needed.

Foe should be used when there's 2 or more casters in the group. The only time I play Foe during 4-man content is when we have a caster and its's for trash aoe pulls. I don't play them for a boss fight, as my dmg decrease isn't worth it.

[Nandalowell]

The circles you guys are running is making me dizzy.

[Eirwen]

The circles you guys are running is making me dizzy.

Yeah... It's clear now! People who play Bard think of their jobs one way, people who hardly/never play Bard think of it the other way.
Bards are DPS. Bards are TP/MP providers. Bards are magic defense lowerers. And for that we have always paid the price with our damage output which was nerfed early on in ARR.

Let's take each other's input on the DPS vs Song provider rants and see how we can use that to grow. Not growl.

[Lewtskie]

seriously your only argument revolves around *it says i am a dps*

your most valuable feature is your songs. if damage was the important part they would take someone who did more but it doesn't matter.

why? because without songs the whole raid fails.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8Oqq0npY1M

I JUST typed this into google and found it; it was THAT easy.

The people who only say we are worth our songs have far too much dependance on them. Fights can be done without them, fights can be done without us. Might he harder, might be easier, but the fact remains those songs don't set anything in stone. AS a DPS we still have the objective of helping to maintain a party-wide average of damage to actually push and complete a fight. If enrage timers didn't exist DPS wouldn't be needed at all. Just tanks and healers could do everything. But they can't, they need DPS. And as DPS they need our damage more than anything else.

That we provide insurance and mechanics that help smooth out longer fights is good, but we still need to manage our natural role.

Yep I did correct myself before even reading your post because I wasn't thinking of every single little encounter I've experienced, otherwise you have nothing special about being able to reach a tube sweetie.

Be as patronizing all you want, honeymuffins, but you haven't really countered my claims with anything but "Oh, well someone else can do it. Not as well as you, but they can." and I'm waiting for reasoning why it's better for them to do it than us.

[Lillia]

Be as patronizing all you want, honeymuffins, but you haven't really countered my claims with anything but "Oh, well someone else can do it. Not as well as you, but they can." and I'm waiting for reasoning why it's better for them to do it than us.

Except I was editing to pass post limit.

[Temjiu]

Hey Folks...Musha is a troll, and it has effectively derailed the conversation for a few pages now. Ignore the Troll.

[Yellow]

Maybe we could give Archers the job they appear to be looking for? An actual ranged TP-using DPS job? Maybe make Bard a separate job you can unlock.. and give it a Harp as a weapon? :P

Seriouslyyy SE, I had a feeling this was going to happen waaaay back when the jobs were announced. Archer getting Bard instead of Hunter.. hmm.