A thought on solving the content gating issue. Long read, pls bare with me.

[Whiteroom]

Here's my issue. Remember how many people hated FF13 because you were basically stuck in a tunnel-shaped game experience for 20 hours?

FF14 is soo much worse right now. At least FF13 had gameplay along the way and an interesting story.

If you have been playing FF14 ever since 2.0 came out, you do NOT understand how much story there is, and how little gameplay, before the game opens up. The game is 90% dialog boxes for the first 50 hours, before reaching the actual MMO part of the game.

What are you talking about, 50 hours? It took you 50 hours to reach level 15? Nothing to do but story along the way? What game were you playing? As for getting faster, maybe you haven't heard about them doubling MSQ exp? What are you on about? The point of the game is not Coil or Alex you know? Those are fully optional side quests...

Citing your claims is debate basics and is not limited to scientific debates. Challenging an unproven claim is not a fallacy. It's a valid way to find out whether you are announcing your personal beliefs instead of facts, or if you are actually contributing something meaningful. I was just wondering if you had a way to prove you were actually right, no need to get defensive. People quitting because of story requirements is a fact, but what is not a proven fact is that SE is losing money over it. (<- That's your original claim if I understand correctly. I hope you are not moving goalposts now. If you were just stating that some amount of individuals quit over it and were not commenting on the total sub numbers, well, that doesn't really add anything of value and no one is in denial about it.) The story structure could be attracting in people who like working through attunements and/or being guided through the game via a single questline (like me for example). The story could also be a compelling reason for long term subscription as opposed to subbing for a month just to try DRK. You calling people delusional for not sharing your beliefs is equally as insignificant as a religious person calling non-believers delusional.



I answered this in the long thread, several times in fact. Last time I used myself as an example but now I'm citing an article about reward structures in games. This is to prove that making the story optional is not as minor a thing as you attempt to make it sound. I'm very curious if you're going to dodge the response again (or imply I'm sadist hahaha).

Gaining access to content is a reward, and rewards are designed to make the player feel like they are advancing in the game. Making the story optional is removing the access-gaining reward from the story. This would reduce the rewards for doing the story and therefore the MSQ experience would be less fun for some of those who would do it anyway (including me). Story gating is the same reward mechanism as gaining levels, as it gives players a sense of progress and a feeling of anticipation of the soon-to-be-accessed content. The following article points out that gating mechanisms indeed do have a psychological effect on players. Making the story optional would affect everyone, not just story haters.

http://www.digra.org/wp-content/uplo...1310.20247.pdf

TLDR: bolded

Well said.

[lydiah]

Snip

That is your opinion and yours alone. I for myself am enjoying the story very much, even 2.0. I'm also enjoying the game as it is. THis is a story driven game, if you don't like story in a MMORPG then you're playing the wrong game. If you dont like the story of this game, then you're playing the wrong game. Stop trying to turn an orange into an apple because you prefer apples.

I hated big parts of WoW and decided, like an adult, that it wasnt for me, and made the decision to quit it and play something else. I didnt go and bitch and moaned and put a tantrum because the game was not transforming into what I wanted. You don't like a product, stop using it, simple as that.

[TessaJalloh]

snip

Rediculous, Yoshi-p's team adds new quests all the time for both new and veteran players to enjoy. If you aren't interested in the quests, this is the wrong mmo for you.

You may be offended by this statement, but it's paramount that you understand that this game isn't about the end of it. It's about the journey, the WHOLE game. Veteran players still have to do the beginner dungeons for example, going back to older content and joining the newer players which then shows off new gear to those players to entice them for what's to come.

If you rush through, you miss 90% of the experience. But, this said, even not rushing, you can now clear the main scenario of 2.0 in about 30 hours. If you read quickly, this can be reduced. The patch storylines of 2.1 to 2.55 will then take you perhaps another 15 hours if you play slowly. break this up and yes... it may take you a couple of months overall of playing a couple of hours a day. But it's hardly unreasonable to expect players to /play/ for the game they paid for.

You can't have both ways, you can't damn games that only offer 5 hours of content, and then complain when you're given more to play with.

As we get more and more, the 2.x storyline will no doubt be streamlined, but this will not happen yet. We simply don't have enough of this game to warrant it yet. Once it's been out another three years and we have another expansion or two, perhaps then the steps necessary for the 2.x story will be reduced. But then players will complain that it's nothing but cutscene to cutscene to cutscene with else between it aside from dungeons.

[OccamX]

That is your opinion... if you don't like story in a MMORPG then you're playing the wrong game.

Of course it's my opinion. I love story in my MMO, and I want to play a story-driven MMO.
My issue is with the structure between gameplay and story. Allow me to illustrate.
S = story
G = gameplay

If you've played since 2.0 came out, your experience went something like this:
SSSSS-GGGGG-SSSSS-GGGGG-SSSSS-GGGGG-SSSSS-GGGGG-SSSSS-GGGGG-SSSSS-GGG....

If you're picking up the game now, and you are interested in endgame, your experience goes like this:
SSSSS-G-SSSSS-G-SSSSS-G-SSSSS-G-SSSSS-G-SSSSS-GGGGG....

If I'm the only person who feels this way, that's one thing. I highly doubt that. I don't know what the solution is, but I hope S-E can find one. Because for me, speaking for myself, it has been a very painful and disappointing experience.

[OccamX]

By the way, I still haven't finished the story. And it's still been 90% of the game for me. I just want to do something different at some point! I'm not a grinder, I don't have the time to get through the story in a single week. I've been working on it for what feels like eternity.

[lydiah]

Snip

Then i'm sorry that it has been your experience and that you are not enjoying it like I do. My gf picked up the game recently and is also having a blast. I like the way the game is going and so does she. To each his own I guess. But I have talked with alot of people in game too and everyone is pretty much having as much as I am. I guess you can either stick with it or don't, but please don't try to change it into something it isnt either.

[OccamX]

It's paramount that you understand that this game isn't about the end of it. It's about the journey, the WHOLE game.
...
If you rush through, you miss 90% of the experience.
...But then players will complain that it's nothing but cutscene to cutscene to cutscene with else between it aside from dungeons.

I like what you said. Yes, perhaps I am rushing through the game. I just don't know what else to do other than the story. To me, clicking through dialog boxes does not feel like a game, at all. So when that's 90% of the game, it just gets tiring for me.

Perhaps I do not see all of my options. The only options I see myself having are:
(1) story story story, so I can play with my friends eventually
(2) level other classes
(3) crafting

[KisaiTenshi]

Here's my issue. Remember how many people hated FF13 because you were basically stuck in a tunnel-shaped game experience for 20 hours?

Nay, FF13's complaint was that it had "nothing to explore" until you hit the endgame. Most pre-FF7 Final Fantasy games opened up the world the minute you got the airship, which was also always near the middle of the game. The along came FF7 and we got a string of games were "pre-rendered" and thus the exploration got nerfed dramatically, and people hate "overworld random battles" ... that's why they gave you the airship to use. FF7 and FF8, still give you "an airship" around the mid-point of the game. FFX, closer to the end. FFX-2 flipped it around and gave you the Airship right at the beginning... and you could do a lot of optional content while holding off on the MSQ. FFXIII didn't give you an airship at all, and the only explorable place was the end-game... and quest nodes... not NPC's. It felt like the endgame was pointless optional quests. This is what happens when you don't let the players explore the world at their own pace. All the optional stuff serves no purpose once you finish the game.

I like what you said. Yes, perhaps I am rushing through the game. I just don't know what else to do other than the story. To me, clicking through dialog boxes does not feel like a game, at all. So when that's 90% of the game, it just gets tiring for me.

Perhaps I do not see all of my options. The only options I see myself having are:
(1) story story story, so I can play with my friends eventually
(2) level other classes
(3) crafting

The Final Fantasy Experience is story-first... sometimes at the cost of gameplay. FF1-4 were inherently more level-grind-padded because of limited cartridge capacity. FF4 was the first with a character driven plot, it was also originally started on the NES. FF5 and FF6 were started on the SNES and have huge storylines and a variety of characters with their own storylines. FF6 IMO is the best 16-bit era RPG aside from Chrono Trigger and Super Mario RPG... which were ALL also by Squaresoft.

Compare the complaints about Final Fantasy games to the complaints about XenoSaga, or Tales of Symphonia. Where you could NOT EVER skip the cutscenes. If you died at whatever combat sequence followed the 20 minute long cutscene... you had to sit through it again, and again. Most Final Fantasy games let you skip the cutscenes and had save points immediately after them.

There comes a point where the story starts to interfere with the gameplay when the GAME ITSELF is forcing you to repeat non-skippable content repeatedly. Currently the only thing in FFXIV that comes close to this kind of irritating behavior are the "storyline" cutscenes that are interstitial to the dungeons. If players don't click the "skip cutscene content I've already seen thank you very much" tickbox then the party constantly has to wait, or proceed without the players watching the cutscenes. Fortunately for HW, they made the final boss a Trial alone instead of a 8-man raid with half a dozen cutscenes on the way.

If someone is spending money on this game and is not enjoying the storyline, they are wasting their money on this game and should be playing something else. There are also people playing other MMORPG's that would rather play FFXIV but can't/won't because they don't have the time commitment to pay for a subscription. That's why I never got into WoW... I was not willing to pay money to subscribe to a game I wasn't even fond of the lore for, no matter how popular it was. Same goes with freemium games with garbage fedex quests... there is no damn way I'm paying for cash shop items to "expediate" my experience to catch up with my friends. I'm either going to play it and enjoy it, or I'm just going to silently quit it while my "friends" don't even notice I'm missing.

It's hard to get friends to switch to other games. So may as well pick ones that everyone likes. When there is a cost commitment to switching, people are much less willing to sink that cost.

With WoW all but turning itself into a Freemium experience with it adopting the EVE-style RMT BS, I think FFXIV may be the only MMORPG that hasn't fallen into the Freemium trap. If FFXIV ever pulls this "instant level 90, get gil from the cash shop" nonsense, I'm giving up on MMORPG's. At that point the MMORPG becomes a casino experience.

[OccamX]

If someone is spending money on this game and is not enjoying the storyline, they are wasting their money on this game and should be playing something else.

This is my dilemma. I have been intentionally paying for FF14 since 2.0 came out, even when I was playing other games. Why? Because I support S-E and want a good, well-funded MMO to compete with WoW. I love WoW, but until their latest expansion their execution of story was lackluster. FF11 did it great.

Anyway, I hate the thought of giving up on FF14. But I also hate the thought of skipping the story. But I also need a break from the story for a while and this game can't give me that. All story must be completed before any time-worthy game options become available. Do I give up on FF14 because it's not for me, or do I come on the forums and hope my voice is heard and they improve my options in the future? I cannot decide.

[Chihaya]

I think the OP's idea is decent though not new.

Phantasy Star Online 2 uses a similar thing.
It currently have Episode I, II, and III.
Episode II is gated behind I, you have to finish I before you can advance to II.
But for Episode III, they added in a video digest of Episode I and II that you can watch (or hit the skip button) and go straight into Episode III. You can still go back and do the Episode I and II stuff later.