WHM Vs AST Healing Comparison at 50

[RazeLandale]

I think aspected benefic stands out as undertuned, in both sects. Healing about a thousand less with those numbers for MORE mana, neverminding that regen is often divine sealed. I appreciate how it frontloads a bit, maybe up the hot a bit and the frontload a lot?

Noct version takes a sizable 50 potency hit next to adlo. Perhaps that would be ok if it were merely about potency, because casting on the move is pretty strong. But it's not just potency because adlo's crazy crit shields. Honestly full strength would probably be fine, but I suppose you could go 10 potency off as that tends to be on par with the norm.

[DreamWeaver]

Forgive my ignorance,

Is AST's healing output without CDs like Divine Seal etc that terrible?

As a WHM, all my CDs (Assize, Asylum, Divine Seal, Tetragammatron) are used so that I can continue DPS, I had never once (I have cleared all HW dungeons) require these CDs to "bring people back from the brink of death".

It was not too long ago this sub forum were lambasting WHMs as they "only have raw healing power and nothing else", ASTs get pretty sweet utility skills that increases raid DPS (Sch's Selene too, but you're giving up the Eos' CDs).

AST is not even 1 week old, there are most likely more nuances, tips and tricks to be learned to fully maximise the abilities of an AST, please give it more time.

The way most of you are voicing your discontent with AST in this topic gives me the feeling that not only you have your cake and want to eat it, you want a beautiful Miqote to feed it to you as well >_>.

[Aphel]

so that I can continue DPS

FYI, as an AST you'll not have time/leeway at all to DPS in dungeons. You can but the Tank's health is gonna drop dangerously low.

I'll list here some examples of our CDs.

Time Dilation (90sec CD) - Increases buffs on target by 15secs (unfortunately only increasing the AST's buffs, no 25sec Hallowed Ground). Quite decent.

Collective Unconscious (90 sec CD) - In heal stance provides 150 potency over 18secs in a small area. In protect stance provides 10% mitigation for 18 secs. The catch? You can't do ANYTHING while you're casting it or it gets cancelled.

Celestial Opposition (150 sec CD) - Stuns nearby enemies for 4 sec, increases buffs by 5 secs. Have yet to test out whether it works on other players' buffs. 150secs???

These are all level 50+ CDs. In no way do they boost our healing in a short period of time. I'm sure you've done FCOB before, the damage spikes in there can be really high (Akh Mon). ASTs can't deal with those properly.

[DreamWeaver]

Don't take things out of context please ,

It was shown in the 1st post that the heal values for AST is pretty similar to WHM, just that WHM has CDs to improve the healing output.

I then stated that I used all my CDs offensively, meaning I did not save any CDs for "oh shit" moments.

Which then means, in a "heal intensive omg we're gonna die" moment, my healing capability is extremely similar to an AST.

As a LV 60 WHM who has cleared all dungeons, never once had i feel pressured by the boss and that my healing output is too low to cope.

I have broken up all my points into different sentences, hope this is clearer for all!!

[Aphel]

Those CDs that improve your output is key to why WHM will always be great at healing. What I meant was that you at least have the luxury to DPS, while us ASTs have to babysit the tank and only DPS very very occasionally.

It's a struggle to heal Vault especially, when my party got smacked to ~30% health with AOEs and fails, I looked at myself and realized that there wasn't anything I could do to quickly get them back to full. The only solution was to instant-helios (at 75% potency, which is basically cleric-stanced Medica 1) all the way and it really really drained my MP.

[RichardButte]

AoE damage buff will be 5% not 15%. Benediction can do the same thing as an "oh crap" heal but on a much longer cooldown so I agree with you on that, a 40sec CD Lustrate isn't all that bad but Lustrate is still better.

Oh whoops. I thought Bole and Balance were giving +150% when royal roaded and spear and arrow were giving +50% and the AoE...

Probably because of how SE refers to exp bonuses. Usually they're talking about ADDING the percent to whatever you're earning. :\

In that case, that's really not that great...

[Kiaris]

Don't take things out of context please ,

It was shown in the 1st post that the heal values for AST is pretty similar to WHM, just that WHM has CDs to improve the healing output.

I then stated that I used all my CDs offensively, meaning I did not save any CDs for "oh shit" moments.

Which then means, in a "heal intensive omg we're gonna die" moment, my healing capability is extremely similar to an AST.

As a LV 60 WHM who has cleared all dungeons, never once had i feel pressured by the boss and that my healing output is too low to cope.

I have broken up all my points into different sentences, hope this is clearer for all!!

If someone who is a level 60 WHM or AST, would post the following.

MND Total Stat
Weapon Stat

We could see the gap between AST and WHM at level 60 on the heals. The higher the MND and weapon stat, the bigger the gap between AST and WHM healing will be.

All my numbers shows.. is at level 50.. they aren't far off, at 60.. i don't know how true this would be.



Everyone can keep saying AST can buff this and this and save the party! or Boost the damage!

1. It takes 60 sec to get a Royal Road off. As you must tuck the first card
2. When you are ready to use your Enhanced Card, you have a 17% Chance... Then you Redraw..for another chance ( i dont feel like doing the math but id guess around a 24% ish chance of getting the card you want) FOR THAT BUFF! that will save the party.
3. You just got Spire , then redrew Spire again. Congrats. you have crappy buffs when they were needed.
4. Yes.. a whole 17% chance to get the buff you want. That sounds very reliable. I was showing a WHM last night in game the cards, they were like omg AST is amazing.. im like ok check this... 4x Spear in a row, then 2x Spire. Fantastic buffs right ?


So my conclusion until somone gives me level 60 info.

AST is a on par healer as WHM, when stuff goes bad.. AST fails.
AST buffs are not even close to reliable, which makes them not good. The most you can do... and best i can see.. is use Spread to save a Bole for the tank in a spike damage situation.

[RichardButte]

So my conclusion until somone gives me level 60 info.

AST is a on par healer as WHM, when stuff goes bad.. AST fails.
AST buffs are not even close to reliable, which makes them not good. The most you can do... and best i can see.. is use Spread to save a Bole for the tank in a spike damage situation.

I must sadly agree.

I thought the buffs were giving +50% or +150%. Given the nature of the AST's RNG based-buffs, this makes absolute sense, as you're more likely to get a buff you DON'T want than a buff you DO want.

But it's apparently potency, not a bonus. So yeah, gonna shelve my AST until SE gets the numbers figured out...

[GideonHighmourn]

Everyone can keep saying AST can buff this and this and save the party! or Boost the damage!

<snip>

AST buffs are not even close to reliable, which makes them not good. The most you can do... and best i can see.. is use Spread to save a Bole for the tank in a spike damage situation.

This is what people don't understand. Yes, on paper, it all looks AMAZING and AST can pull lots of utility. However, it's 100% unreliable and random. You can't pick and choose from the list what you're getting; you can just cross your fingers and hope you'll get something useful. If Sacred Soil, Divine Seal, Presence of Mind, Fey Wind, etc. only had a 1 in 6 chance of casting successfully, they'd be equal; however, that's not the case.

[Staris]

When usually 50+ % of whm healing in a raid is going to be overhealing, having slightly less potent heals with less mana cost is a huge buff.
This is especially true if you can drop the bard, or even just use less mana song because bard dps is not the greatest at the moment.

Not to mention the Alpha on Astro Regen is > WHM regen which is important for lots of hp check mechanics.

Add to it that both dots don't require accuracy & the card buffs and your most likely going to be significantly more effective than a WHM in any challenging end game content.

I don't see it nearly as good as a SCH replacement.