Bard - they broke my job

[yamochan]

raising the bow dmg would do nothing at all cause most of us will complain about the dmg output but about the playstyle we love and wich got taken away from us. the only real fix that would solve the problem is: we can still use WM and we get the 20% buff BUT all of our old skills are instant again and only our 3 new skills wich we can only use in WM anyways have cast time. that fix would work out and it would not overpower the bards dps. we are about 300 (or more) behind the top Damage dealers this fix would put us about 100 behind and with songs that would give us our raidspot again. as it is now no bard will ever see any raidboss at all!

[Cetonis]

The loss of mobility is the point, not the problem; WM is supposed to help us when our mobility isn't relevant enough to be an advantage. The actual problem is, that it isn't doing that job very well.

The core issues with WM are (1) WM'd Heavy / Straight Shots are a DPS loss, which warps the calculations on when it's worth using; (2) WM'd Barrage outpaces normal Barrage by so much it makes gimmick stance dancing a thing, and (3) WM fails to give enough of a boost to achieve its goals if there's even occasional non-predictable movement.

So I think step 1 to fix Wanderer's Minuet is probably something like:

- increase Heavy Shot potency to 180 when under the effect of Barrage or Wanderer's Minuet
- decrease Empyreal Arrow potency to 210

Because without going after Heavy Shot directly, you can't really solve issue (1) in a good way. This would also up the theoretical gain from 10% to 16.6%, which could bring the practical gain up to something more worthwhile more often.

[Wishles]

I think Bard itself just need an overall potency increase under WM. Even under WM, our DPS lacks and falls behind all other classes (except for MCH) a noticeable amount, i.e. dummy test comparisons.

People also have to realize that it is not just the playstyle change that needs reworking -- the total damage itself and purported increase with WM is incredibly low at 60 and endgame.

[SethLex]

The loss of mobility is the point, not the problem

Sry, but that's like saying the loss of aggro skills for a tank is not the problem. The mobility is what makes the class, not the dps.

[Wishles]

I'd just caution that it is naive to say that a DPS class, although labeled as "support", should not have a competitively high dps comparable with the other DPS classes. This kind of thinking is exactly what brought the Bard class to this low point.

[Entropic]

Too bad we don't get an official statement about that issue.
It's clear that bards and mechs are broken and underperforming so hard that it's not worth at all to bring them into Raids / Dungeons.

[PinnyAerani]

Why do I have a feeling that everyone screaming doom and gloom are staying in WM/GB 100% of the time trying to play exactly like they did before the expansion came out? Either way, saying bards/machinists aren't worth bringing to raids or dungeons anymore is funny. Outside of the DPS, have fun running out of mana/TP all the time when you can't manage them properly.

[Cetonis]

Sry, but that's like saying the loss of aggro skills for a tank is not the problem. The mobility is what makes the class, not the dps.

And when the mobility doesn't matter, then what? We're just bad? SE has to make sure people's TP runs out so that they have to put up with us?

When tanks don't need to hold aggro, they have a stance they can go into to deal somewhat more respectable damage, and it does its job. When Bards don't need to move, they have a stance they can go into to deal more respectable damage relative to other DPS, and it is -not- doing its job.

[Wavaryen]

Why do I have a feeling that everyone screaming doom and gloom are staying in WM/GB 100% of the time trying to play exactly like they did before the expansion came out? Either way, saying bards/machinists aren't worth bringing to raids or dungeons anymore is funny. Outside of the DPS, have fun running out of mana/TP all the time when you can't manage them properly.

That would be a problem with the class I think. If people found a play style fun, and they changed it so much that the class does not play the same. I can't blame people for wanting to try to find fun again.

Xpack should add on to a play style and class. Changing it this much, I can understand the hate or people trying to find fun, even at a lost of dps.

[Sessurea]

LF>%damage increase on all skills regardless of wm on/off and LF>WM toggle like cleric stance. I'd be a much happier brd then.